Strange(False)Ending in MInnesota 3A semi-final

[johnnyg08]

The issue that caused the drama dealt with whether or not there was a tag.

With the benefit of the video, there's no question that there WAS a tag BUT the umpires didn't have the luxury of the video.

After the conference the umpires determined that no umpire called the batter/runner out on a tag, the batter runner reached 1b, so they placed him at 1b.

That's the scoop folks.

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by johnnyg08

The issue that caused the drama dealt with whether or not there was a tag.

With the benefit of the video, there's no question that there WAS a tag BUT the umpires didn't have the luxury of the video.

After the conference the umpires determined that no umpire called the batter/runner out on a tag, the batter runner reached 1b, so they placed him at 1b.

That's the scoop folks.

Once you determine the pitch was not caught, which he knew it wasn't, all you have to worry about is tag/no tag. I don't see how you could not have a tag here, especially since after the catcher tagged him he took off running to his teammates. Also, what did the PU signal after the catcher turned around and looked at him? After the tag, the catcher started to point at first base, then starts celebrating. It looks like the PU may have given an out mechanic.

The ball was in the catcher's hand. If you pause it at about the 8 second mark you can see white inside his hand. Also, you can tell he is pulling the ball out of his mitt after he blocks the pitch.

Edit: How did neither BU see the catcher tag the batter? U1 has nothing else going on here. When they got together, he should have stepped up and told the PU there was a tag.

[johnnyg08]

Not sure but that's what went down. Those are the facts of the situation.

With the benefit of the video, it is obvious that there was a tag. But according to my sources there was never an official "out" mechanic. As for what the base umpires were doing or watching...I can't speak for that, but I can tell you that they didn't see a tag for 100% or they would've called him out.

[CT1]

Once again we get ourselves into hot water because of poor mechanics.

When F2 attempted a tag, if PU didn't see a tag he should have signalled and verbalized "No tag!" This would have let everyone know what the status of the BR was.

[RPatrino]

No matter how you spin this, it was a cluster. These are clearly some good umpires that got into a very unpleasant situation, one that I am sure we wouldn't wish on anyone. Given that there were no ejections, protests, riots or civil unrest, I would say everyone got out alive.

For one, I am convinced that our mechanics will make or break us, as I believe the judgment was sound on this play. The way the judgement was delivered caused the problems we all have seen.

[johnnyg08]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

No matter how you spin this, it was a cluster. These are clearly some good umpires that got into a very unpleasant situation, one that I am sure we wouldn't wish on anyone. Given that there were no ejections, protests, riots or civil unrest, I would say everyone got out alive.

For one, I am convinced that our mechanics will make or break us, as I believe the judgment was sound on this play. The way the judgement was delivered caused the problems we all have seen.

I think your post is a great way to sum this up.

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by johnnyg08

I think your post is a great way to sum this up.

Like I said earlier, the "no catch" mechanic wasn't necessary. The PU got too mechanic happy.

One time on a close play at the plate, I gave a, "Safe, balls on the ground!" mechanic when the catcher didn't quite control the throw. The defensive coach asked me, "Would he have been out if he held on to the ball?" I thought for a second, said, "Probably not, I was just letting everyone know there wasn't a controlled ball."

It made me ponder, why give something if it's not really necessary. That's why I will never use a "that's nothing" signal (?) if I have nothing to call.

Like I said earlier, overkill on the mechanics.

[David B]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

No matter how you spin this, it was a cluster. These are clearly some good umpires that got into a very unpleasant situation, one that I am sure we wouldn't wish on anyone. Given that there were no ejections, protests, riots or civil unrest, I would say everyone got out alive.

For one, I am convinced that our mechanics will make or break us, as I believe the judgment was sound on this play. The way the judgement was delivered caused the problems we all have seen.

Good points, but sometimes especially in a "big game" situation, you just have to umpire.

The reaction of F2 on the plays tells you as PU that he made the tag. He would have known if he did NOT tag him and reacted accordingly. He also is seen looking at the PU for confirmation. The BR reacts the same way then runs to 1st thinking it was ball 4.

I'm sure that the other umpires had no clue as to whether a tag was made or not and probably were not even looking at that play.

Thanks
David

[Matt]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

Given that there were no ejections, protests, riots or civil unrest, I would say everyone got out alive.

The baseball gods reserved that for the other site of this tournament.

[paulsonj72]

Originally Posted by Matt

The baseball gods reserved that for the other site of this tournament.

Just currious, what happened over at Dunning Field(or during the title game at Target Field) I'm just curious.