LLWS and replay

[njdevs00cup]

Originally Posted by BretMan

I don't necessarily disagree that six is too many. But, let's say we dumped the two guys standing in the outfield twiddeling their thumbs most of the game. How would that have any bearing on the other four "almost getting hit by throws, getting in the way of fielders and almost contacting base runners"?

BretMan, I can see your point because the base umpires were the umpires getting in the way, not the line umpires. Eye contact and communication between umpires is very important, especially when working with larger crews. This may take longer when the crew members are not familiar with each other or the six man system. That, along with the small field confines made it look like it was difficult to potentially make a call and get inside while avoiding incoming throws, runners and fielders.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by njdevs00cup

BretMan, I can see your point because the base umpires were the umpires getting in the way, not the line umpires. Eye contact and communication between umpires is very important, especially when working with larger crews. This may take longer when the crew members are not familiar with each other or the six man system. That, along with the small field confines made it look like it was difficult to potentially make a call and get inside while avoiding incoming throws, runners and fielders.

Why get inside, though? It's just as easy to get an angle from the outside and, bonus, you're not in the way of the players.

[njdevs00cup]

Rich, from what I've seen the 2B umpire (not 1B & 3B umpire) busts inside on balls hit to the outfield. I'm not sure if he/she has any coverage responsibilities regarding fly ball/trouble ball coverage to the outfield with a six man system in Little League. Most of the issues with almost getting hit by throws, and interfering with fielders and runners were on plays around second base. A lot of people in a small space.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by njdevs00cup

Rich, from what I've seen the 2B umpire (not 1B & 3B umpire) busts inside on balls hit to the outfield. I'm not sure if he/she has any coverage responsibilities regarding fly ball/trouble ball coverage to the outfield with a six man system in Little League. Most of the issues with almost getting hit by throws, and interfering with fielders and runners were on plays around second base. A lot of people in a small space.

Not really... think of softball, also played on a 60 foot diamond. In any number of man mechanics, SOMEone is going to be in that inside area on balls hit to the outfield. There's plenty of room. The issues around 2nd have nothing to do with 6-man mechanics being used where they shouldn't, but rather due to untrained umpires who have not worked together not knowing what to do or where to be.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by njdevs00cup

Rich, from what I've seen the 2B umpire (not 1B & 3B umpire) busts inside on balls hit to the outfield. I'm not sure if he/she has any coverage responsibilities regarding fly ball/trouble ball coverage to the outfield with a six man system in Little League. Most of the issues with almost getting hit by throws, and interfering with fielders and runners were on plays around second base. A lot of people in a small space.

There's no need to bust anywhere. Go opposite the ball, make sure you're out of the way, and if necessary, make a call -- even from the outside. False hustle to get inside at the cutout before the ball comes in. Unnecessary.

[BigUmp56]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

There's no need to bust anywhere. Go opposite the ball, make sure you're out of the way, and if necessary, make a call -- even from the outside. False hustle to get inside at the cutout before the ball comes in. Unnecessary.

I completely agree and I'm glad someone else has said it. If you have to work a four man crew on the small diamond, there's no reason for anyone to be on the inside except the PU. You can make calls as easily from the outside with proper positioning without having to bust inside. It's too messy to have umpires moving inside on that small of a field.

Tim.

[Tim C]

" . . . LL is a volunteer organization and the volunteers are the ones who deserve the honor and privilege . . .

As I have noted before:

Volunteer Little League Umpiring = "Glamorous Baby Sitting"

JMO

T

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by tim c

as i have noted before:

Volunteer little league umpiring = "glamorous baby sitting"

jmo

t

+100!!!!

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Tim C

As I have noted before:

Volunteer Little League Umpiring = "Glamorous Baby Sitting"

JMO

T

You know me and you know I work LL and worked one of the eight World Series tournaments this year -- I'd hope that people that know me and have met me (and/or have seen me umpire) would stop and think, "Hey, Rich does this. There are good umpires that work LL games." Guess not. Your blanket generalization notwithstanding, I guess if I should ever be fortunate enough to be selected for Williamsport I'll have to listen to people on this and other forums say how I'm just a glorified babysitter. That's OK with me.

I don't personally know THoy -- I know he was the third base umpire who called the ball foul that hit the bag. I know he was a minor league umpire and a guy who has owned his mistake. And all of us have made similar mistakes before -- only a few get to make them in front of a nationwide audience.

BTW, I was watching the Phillies/Braves last night. Dale Scott was on the plate, Jerry Meals at first. Ball hit up the line, fielded by Ryan Howard a few feet in front of the bag. Scott (from the plate) pointed fair, Meals pointed foul.

[THoy]

Originally Posted by Tim C

As I have noted before:

Volunteer Little League Umpiring = "Glamorous Baby Sitting"

JMO

T

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. If it makes people feel better about their game to think this way than thats fine. When we volunteer umpire we help to give the kids a positive experience. The more we strive to be the best umpire we can be, the better the experience for the kids. The World Series is a place where the volunteer umpires are rewarded for their service and dedication. Opinions like the one above seem to reveal a disdain for the Little Umpire for reasons that I can only speculate. I am giving back to the program that gave so much to me and my family. Little League is my family as I have volunteered at the Western Region for over 20 years. So if what I do is "glorified babysitting" then so be it. I enjoy it, and I don't have to tell myself how good I am......I will let the kids, coaches, and evalutors be the judge of that.

The Little League World Series topped any level I have ever worked. It was an experience I will never forget as long as I live. I made friendships that will last a lifetime. I left everything I had to give on Volunteer and Lamade Stadiums and was not the least bit jeolous of my brothers who worked on Sunday. I enjoyed watching them from the stands with my family by my side. By not taking myself too seriously and following the main administrative directive of HAVING FUN...I did my best to provide those kids with the best quality umpiring that I was able to deliver. I only hope that my experience will inspire others to desire the World Series stage that I was fortunate enough to grace if only for a moment...Rich the Series is everything I have described and more. Let me know when you get the call....hopefully I can be there!

[MD Longhorn]

You don't have to speculate... you've been given the reasons. Multiple times no less.

[THoy]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

You don't have to speculate... you've been given the reasons. Multiple times no less.

I apologize if I have offended you. However, I should be able to defend my position....should I not?

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by THoy

I apologize if I have offended you. However, I should be able to defend my position....should I not?

When did I say you offended me? Thin skinned today? You said,

Opinions like the one above seem to reveal a disdain for the Little Umpire for reasons that I can only speculate.

Why do you need to speculate? Those reasons have been given ad nauseum, and many times in this thread alone.

I have no problem with someone who is willing to invest their time in learning to umpire correctly choosing whatever organization they like to ply their wares. But honestly - if you're working LL for free, you should know that you're giving away services to a group who don't feel your services deserve pay. That says everything most officials need to know about LL. The umpiring is inherently and necessarily worse at LL, solely because this refusal to pay pushes a great number of umpires elsewhere. I'm not saying it's impossible to be good and work LL. Just that the overall general talent level is lower because the pool of umpires who will work for them is smaller.

I will say this. I worked LL some this summer. I worked because I was begged and even then - they paid me, whether they were supposed to or not. Working those games was miserable. One partner meant well but had ZERO training. Another partner was a truly nice guy, but had no clue and had no intention of learning either. He let a coach walk all over him the game I worked with him - and when we got together between games he INSISTED he would never eject a coach because "it's all about the kids." He didn't seem to understand or WANT to understand that allowing that kind of crap was not "for the kids" and he was doing himself AND all the umpires that followed him a huge disservice. I'm given to understand that this quality is about equal across that district.

[Tim C]

Rich:

I have met you, you watched me work and we have had a few (err, many) adult beverages together.

You know that I respect you greatly.

All being said, I have been the critic of Little League Baseball from day one on this board.

I find the LLWS as one of the worst explotations of children EVER. I hate the "Worldwide Leader" as a general statement and find no redeeming social value of what they do with the LLWS.

Again, all that being said: People that give away a skill set to an association that makes HUGE money (or soccer moms that buy $300 bats) are doing a tremendous disservice to umpiring.

When a guy named Hoy comes on here and tries to take umpires to task for simply saying the truth it ruffles my hackle.

Having worked games with over 50,000 screaming fans in attendance really changed nothing when I worked a game.

T

[THoy]

Originally Posted by Tim C

Rich:

I have met you, you watched me work and we have had a few (err, many) adult beverages together.

You know that I respect you greatly.

All being said, I have been the critic of Little League Baseball from day one on this board.

I find the LLWS as one of the worst explotations of children EVER. I hate the "Worldwide Leader" as a general statement and find no redeeming social value of what they do with the LLWS.

Again, all that being said: People that give away a skill set to an association that makes HUGE money (or soccer moms that buy $300 bats) are doing a tremendous disservice to umpiring.

When a guy named Hoy comes on here and tries to take umpires to task for simply saying the truth it ruffles my hackle.

Having worked games with over 50,000 screaming fans in attendance really changed nothing when I worked a game.

T

Tim-

Like I have said before everyone is entitled to their opinion. With that being said, truth be told that umpires make mistakes (which ALL umpires do) IMHO they should not when "saying the truth" berate other umpires. Objectively speaking that only speaks to their own insecurities when it comes to umpiring. I am sure we could all watch each other work and pick each other apart, and I can only speak for myself when I say I would certainly not offer any "constructive criticism" unless it was requested. I am a big boy that certainly can handle criticism, however if people are going to throw bombs they should be prepared for the aftermath.

I am certainly and sincerely glad that you have had the opportunity to work in front of large crowds on a consistent basis. It doesnt change the manner in which I work either, however one would certainly not be truthful in saying that it did not add a certain level of intensity to the situation. Further, to claim that it did not would also be an indication of not having done so.

To conlcude, if I wish to "give away" a skill set to an organization that is clearly my choice in doing so. If you, or anyone else has a problem with that then that is your/their problem. My issue is with the berating of other fellow umpires for whatever reason. I could drop names of people I have worked with and blah, blah,blah. I will say only this... I have worked and instructed with with several professionals...and they would never trash other umpires...professional or amatuer..for thier own enjoyment or bolstering of a false sense of confidence.