Would you take the field with this guy?

[MikeStrybel]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I sit on a committee that is run by Craig and previously Dave. I have not only had this conversation with him, but he came to speak an association meeting that I am a member when he addressed the issue directly. Actually this information was about the post season which was clear to me, but he has said that we can still wear other colors during the regular season. Also when you go to the State Finals these things are often discussed in detail and this was one of the issues. Which is why if you ever see pictures of me and that crew, we wore the darker grey pants before they were listed in the handbook (2009). If you want me to I can find out or you can come to the summer conference and hear things for yourself (people seem to like to hear things from the horse's mouth more than from another representative) and ask him what the policy is instead of taking my word for it. I know Dave is no longer there, but this policy did not live and die with just Dave. Most of these policies are Board decisions and things the IHSA Board agrees is allowed. Just telling you what I know and I am one of those guys that like to ask questions so I do what is right when I work with someone. Also if a Clinician or State Interpreter talked about this, chances are they know what they are talking about in a policy like this.
Peace

Jeff, I am an IHSA clinician. I know what I am talking about.

I spoke directly to Craig about this issue at the beginning of April. The next day, Craig posted the policy I stated above. You cannot get much clearer than that.

If he chooses to issue a different policy next year, so be it. Like the rules, I try not to choose which ones in the past are better than current versions.

[MikeStrybel]

Originally Posted by UmpJM (nee CoachJM)

Mike,

What about the "heather gray" pants and Navy or Gray ball bag provisions?

(Careful, I've got pictures! )

JM

We have a separate policy statement regarding which slacks are approved. The charcoal gray slacks will be the mandate soon but are good to go now.

I have a couple grey ball bags and used them in my last Super. When the vendors show up at the IHSA, NCAA or local meetings, I don't see anything but black there. Black was approved for playoffs in IHSA ball, probably because the other colors have limited availability.

I saw the note about white on Jeff's shoes and that is not an issue any longer. From the bigs on down, you will see white on umpire's shoes - usually the bases, but even some plate shoes have the MLB logo in white now. Tourney ball is on TV now and I saw more than a few sporting white on their Reeboks. I prefer all black but wear a 13 so I take what is available and not upcharged for size. The new Reeboks (plate and base) fit the bill this year.

Finals are this week and I know most of the guys working it. We will see white on some shoes, charcoal grey slacks, black ball bags and...navy blue shirts and hats. Hopefully, we will also see some excellent baseball and terrific officiating. I hope IHSA.tv runs it for all to see.

[jicecone]

None of this is as bad as Louisiana. They are going with BLAcK shirts next year. It's way TOO hot to begin with here and some neanderthal picks Black.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

Jeff, I am an IHSA clinician. I know what I am talking about.

I spoke directly to Craig about this issue at the beginning of April. The next day, Craig posted the policy I stated above. You cannot get much clearer than that.

If he chooses to issue a different policy next year, so be it. Like the rules, I try not to choose which ones in the past are better than current versions.

I am one too in another sport and he was asked this question at an association meeting. I like to get these things clarified as people often think I have some connection with those I work with. I believe this question was asked of him also in April at an association meeting. I might go to the State Tournament this weekend and I will just ask him or Brad when I see them. Because no one I am aware of changed the policy including him. Now you got me curious why different people have different information. And I believe this issue was covered in the Rules video as well.

Peace

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

We have a separate policy statement regarding which slacks are approved. The charcoal gray slacks will be the mandate soon but are good to go now.

I have a couple grey ball bags and used them in my last Super. When the vendors show up at the IHSA, NCAA or local meetings, I don't see anything but black there. Black was approved for playoffs in IHSA ball, probably because the other colors have limited availability.

I saw the note about white on Jeff's shoes and that is not an issue any longer. From the bigs on down, you will see white on umpire's shoes - usually the bases, but even some plate shoes have the MLB logo in white now. Tourney ball is on TV now and I saw more than a few sporting white on their Reeboks. I prefer all black but wear a 13 so I take what is available and not upcharged for size. The new Reeboks (plate and base) fit the bill this year.

Actually that was not a problem before I worked that Finals. I knew several guys that wore shoes with white on their shoes before I got there. The only reason I ever tried this was because of what others did. Those happened to be my most comfortable shoes so that is what I wore. I was prepared to mark the white N out.

Peace

[MikeStrybel]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I am one too in another sport and he was asked this question at an association meeting. I like to get these things clarified as people often think I have some connection with those I work with. I believe this question was asked of him also in April at an association meeting. I might go to the State Tournament this weekend and I will just ask him or Brad when I see them. Because no one I am aware of changed the policy including him. Now you got me curious why different people have different information. And I believe this issue was covered in the Rules video as well.

Peace

I'm not going to do this with you. I copied what Craig posted on the IHSA website in April. If you choose to believe that those words aren't a change in the policy of 'wear whatever you want, just as long as you match your partner', so be it. Craig wrote those words, he should be 'someone you are aware of'.

The day before speaking with Craig about uniform mandates, I called and talked to Brad. Both stated the official uniform policy from our handbook is in effect. The reasons why some people have different information is because they choose not to read what is on the site, are stubborn or could care less. None of those change the facts that I provided in this thread. I wish you well.

[MikeStrybel]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Actually that was not a problem before I worked that Finals. I knew several guys that wore shoes with white on their shoes before I got there. The only reason I ever tried this was because of what others did. Those happened to be my most comfortable shoes so that is what I wore. I was prepared to mark the white N out.

Peace

Many guys followed the lead of MiLB, MLB and NCAA umpires. They blacked out the white on their shoes for years. Some of them looked down on those who had white visible and that is why it was a probem. Now that the pros are sporting them it has been a non issue. I could care less what a guy has on his feet, as long as he is safe and able to get on top of the call.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

I'm not going to do this with you. I copied what Craig posted on the IHSA website in April. If you choose to believe that those words aren't a change in the policy of 'wear whatever you want, just as long as you match your partner', so be it. Craig wrote those words, he should be 'someone you are aware of'.

Mike,

Not sure why you are so defensive. I am going to ask because there has been a lot of confusion. I would rather talk to him than others who make claims or say this is the policy or is not the policy. We have the same problem in basketball where clinicians are telling officials different things. I will ask him for clarification and yes I did read the words but did not interpret it other than what happens in the post season when those comments were so close to what we discussed at a meeting. Again I said this was discussed at a meeting, I just want to make it clear for myself.

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

The day before speaking with Craig about uniform mandates, I called and talked to Brad. Both stated the official uniform policy from our handbook is in effect. The reasons why some people have different information is because they choose not to read what is on the site, are stubborn or could care less. None of those change the facts that I provided in this thread. I wish you well.

Just so you know when Dave implemented the policy to use whatever pullover color we wished, it was not reflected in Handbook.

Again I am a three sport officials that belongs to a football crew with 3 football clinicians and we hear different stuff in that sport all the time. And the Black pants were not reflected in the first year that Dave G allowed us to wear them. And we had to get clarification for when to wear those pants from the traditional knickers. In basketball people were running around like chickens with their head's cut off when they started to allow the new patches and there is still confusion if everyone must have the same patches vs. embroidery to work a game. The bottom line is the IHSA in my opinion has done a very poor job over multiple sports to get the word out when changes are being made. This situation is no different and I want to hear it for myself because as JM said there are Baseball Clinicians that have been going around telling those that this is the policy and all you are doing is causing confusion when you say that the policy has changed (not something you are doing on purpose at all BTW). Craig was not clear that the policy was changed and he let us know when the post season was about to start. And it is not like people were doing things well before that time.

Relax dude, it is OK. I just like to ask for myself when I know the people involved. I do the same all the time when we have confusion in my other sports and especially the sport that I hold the same position because there is a lot of misinformation out there and I do not want to assume anything. I will talk to them and I am sure this will be clarified for me. I have a reputation to uphold and I want to do what we are supposed to do.

Peace

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

Many guys followed the lead of MiLB, MLB and NCAA umpires. They blacked out the white on their shoes for years. Some of them looked down on those who had white visible and that is why it was a probem. Now that the pros are sporting them it has been a non issue. I could care less what a guy has on his feet, as long as he is safe and able to get on top of the call.

I don't either, but some were worried about it and even asked me when those pictures were posted. But I knew before that year what was allowed at least when Anthony was in that position. Again, I like to ask the people that are making the decision so I can reference them specifically. No big deal to me and it was not a big deal at the time.

Peace

[MikeStrybel]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Mike,

Not sure why you are so defensive. I am going to ask because there has been a lot of confusion. I would rather talk to him than others who make claims or say this is the policy or is not the policy.

Jeff, you stated that you would believe a clinician telling you the facts. Then you found out that I am one of them. I am not claiming anything. I copied and pasted what you and every other baseball official can see on our site. Craig wrote what he did. I merely repeated it.

We have the same problem in basketball where clinicians are telling officials different things. I will ask him for clarification and yes I did read the words but did not interpret it other than what happens in the post season when those comments were so close to what we discussed at a meeting. Again I said this was discussed at a meeting, I just want to make it clear for myself.

Seriously Jeff, there is NO MENTION OF POSTSEASON anywhere in his post made in April. If an umpire is confused by that then they really shouldn't be working a varsity schedule.

The handbook states the policy for uniforms. It is the same as Craig's admonition.

Post season uniforms are a whole different matter and not relevant to our discussion.

Just so you know when Dave implemented the policy to use whatever pullover color we wished, it was not reflected in Handbook.
Peace

I was aware of it. Dave is no longer here. Anthony is no longer here. Craig made his clarification after some of us were confused by what we were seeing. I wore what my partners did, which was largely the black shirt and jacket. One day, someone who knows me to be a baseball clinician commented that he was going to rate me poorly because of it. Yes, he was from another group and figured he'd improve his standing by tossing me under the bus. It didn't work.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

Jeff, you stated that you would believe a clinician telling you the facts. Then you found out that I am one of them. I am not claiming anything. I copied and pasted what you and every other baseball official can see on our site. Craig wrote what he did. I merely repeated it.



Seriously Jeff, there is NO MENTION OF POSTSEASON anywhere in his post made in April. If an umpire is confused by that then they really shouldn't be working a varsity schedule.

The handbook states the policy for uniforms. It is the same as Craig's admonition.

Post season uniforms are a whole different matter and not relevant to our discussion.




I was aware of it. Dave is no longer here. Anthony is no longer here. Craig made his clarification after some of us were confused by what we were seeing. I wore what my partners did, which was largely the black shirt and jacket. One day, someone who knows me to be a baseball clinician commented that he was going to rate me poorly because of it. Yes, he was from another group and figured he'd improve his standing by tossing me under the bus. It didn't work.

How are you working to influence the IHSA to change the uniform policy?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

Jeff, you stated that you would believe a clinician telling you the facts. Then you found out that I am one of them. I am not claiming anything. I copied and pasted what you and every other baseball official can see on our site. Craig wrote what he did. I merely repeated it.

Mark this is really not about you. Just stated that I would ask for clarification as Craig appeared to suggest something other than what you are saying here. I just want to know for myself. Is that OK? I would expect others to do the same if I made a claim here. You never have to take my word for it; I have no problem if you contact the people above me to make sure. Sometimes there is miscommunication. It happens often in our position.

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

Seriously Jeff, there is NO MENTION OF POSTSEASON anywhere in his post made in April. If an umpire is confused by that then they really shouldn't be working a varsity schedule.

The handbook states the policy for uniforms. It is the same as Craig's admonition.

Post season uniforms are a whole different matter and not relevant to our discussion.

OK Mike, it is not a big deal to me. Again I might see them this coming weekend and I will ask. Part of that conversation will have nothing to do with this topic. I had to talk to him about another matter that is related to something this summer and something I am doing for the IHSA. I just will ask about this too. It would not be there first time there is some confusion.

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

I was aware of it. Dave is no longer here. Anthony is no longer here. Craig made his clarification after some of us were confused by what we were seeing. I wore what my partners did, which was largely the black shirt and jacket. One day, someone who knows me to be a baseball clinician commented that he was going to rate me poorly because of it. Yes, he was from another group and figured he'd improve his standing by tossing me under the bus. It didn't work.

OK, but the policy was stated before Craig got here and it was not clear that this was a total change from previous policy, not when they were selling items this summer that suggested otherwise with their licensed vendor going into this current school year. And if you wore something different than the state wanted you to work that was on you. My point is not to question your position, but to get clarification because your fellow baseball clinicians are telling people other things. I just want clarification so we all are on the same page and I can protect myself in the future from violating a policy. And I will inform him that there is not clear information being distributed. Your name will not be mentioned I promise. I have had several people ask the state based on information I had been told and they confirmed what I said. I am sure you are right here; I just want him to know that people are not following the policy or unaware. Again this is what the summer conference is for and why I want clarification before I say something on the behalf of the IHSA and I am not correct.

Peace

[Publius]

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

It just seems funny how some guys who only carry black shirts and jackets and wear no patches are upset when passed by for playoff assignments. They are excellent umpires but refuse to comply. Whether stubborn, hurt by the economy or otherwise, I would love to see some of them shining during post season. Guys who make a living enforcing rules but refuse to follow them are lost on me.

I used to be one of those guys. When I understood and accepted that those playoff assignments were based more on form than substance, I stopped getting upset.

I don't find it necessary to adhere to uniform "rules" because as an independent contractor, what I wear is my province. If the state association wants to prescribe my clothing, they can opt for an employer/employee relationship.

If their choice is to take lesser-quality umpires because they wear blue shirts with patches and have shiny shoes, that says more about them than it does about me.

You make think of people who don't conform as stubborn, but what of the people who makes those "rules?" What are they other than control freaks?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Publius

I used to be one of those guys. When I understood and accepted that those playoff assignments were based more on form than substance, I stopped getting upset.

I don't find it necessary to adhere to uniform "rules" because as an independent contractor, what I wear is my province. If the state association wants to prescribe my clothing, they can opt for an employer/employee relationship.

If their choice is to take lesser-quality umpires because they wear blue shirts with patches and have shiny shoes, that says more about them than it does about me.

You make think of people who don't conform as stubborn, but what of the people who makes those "rules?" What are they other than control freaks?

Well that sounds great, but if someone takes your license or stops giving you games at that level, then you will not have to worry about it at all.

Peace

[yawetag]

Originally Posted by Publius

I don't find it necessary to adhere to uniform "rules" because as an independent contractor, what I wear is my province. If the state association wants to prescribe my clothing, they can opt for an employer/employee relationship.

You have a misguided idea of a contractor/employer relationship.