Who's Got First?

johnnyg08 · #1 (**permalink**) Thu Mar 10, 2011, 10:19am

I've had plays like this before. I've been on BU, we've pregamed it...I owned my call...some coaches around here think we have to get help on everything, knowing nothign about our mechanics...there's no way my partner would've seen it.

I had the best look I could get, my partner was watching something else...maybe a touch of 3B, or something else...I took the heat, was in the best position possible and stuck w/ my call w/o asking for help. Right or wrong we do the best we can when working two-man.

Garth Vader · #2 (**permalink**) Thu Mar 10, 2011, 10:22am

i would think that getting the call right would be the most important thing

Simply The Best · #3 (**permalink**) Thu Mar 10, 2011, 10:44am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garth Vader

i would think that getting the call right would be the most important thing

It is but four posters before you sure don't think so.

Check your egos at the door and get the call right.

johnnyg08 · #4 (**permalink**) Thu Mar 10, 2011, 10:53am

Right, but mechanically when I know that my partner wasn't even looking, I'm not going to ask him just to appease somebody who's never opened a mechanics manual.

Rich · #5 (**permalink**) Thu Mar 10, 2011, 11:13am

I like how those with an agenda always lean on the ego canard.

Truth is, umpires have specific responsibilities on plays. Since the base umpire is in B, that means that there are runners (I'm guessing) on first or first/third.

If there's R1/R3, the PU has to watch the touch of the plate. Period. Even if the umpire tried to sneak a peek, he's behind the plate and probably 95-100 feet away with a terrible look.

If there's R1, how is the crew handling R1 going to third? If it was agreed that the PU was covering third on this play, he's already heading up the line and the BU has to move to get in place to get this call. If the BU is covering third, then the PU might be able to get up the line to get a decent look.

But instead of wringing our hands and talking about "getting help," how about I ask the OP what he did to move into position to make this call. Did he move aggressively a few steps towards the 45 foot line between the plate and first in order to get the best possible angle on the play, keeping in mind there could be a subsequent play, depending on coverages?

I guarantee this: I will never ask a partner when I'm certain I have the best possible look at a play and I know my partner doesn't have a better look. And that means that me asking for help happens about every 10 years. I've worked with many base umpires who stand still, get straight-lined, and ask multiple times in a GAME. With umpires like this, we're dealing with a symptom here, not the disease.

kylejt · #6 (**permalink**) Thu Mar 10, 2011, 11:07am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garth Vader

i would think that getting the call right would be the most important thing

Negative.

Getting the procedure right is the most important thing.

There's only two guys on the planet I work with that I'd go to first on a call like this. And that would only be in the 60' field, if I were in C, behind the shortstop. Only two guys that I'd trust had my back.

Now if a coach came out to ask me to get help(nicely, of course), and I had doubt (and a good partner), I'd entertain it. Other than that, he's still safe.

Garth Vader · #7 (**permalink**) Thu Mar 10, 2011, 11:21am

Quote:

Originally Posted by kylejt

Negative.

Getting the procedure right is the most important thing.

Quote:

There's only two guys on the planet I work with that I'd go to first on a call like this. And that would only be in the 60' field, if I were in C, behind the shortstop. Only two guys that I'd trust had my back.

Now if a coach came out to ask me to get help(nicely, of course), and I had doubt (and a good partner), I'd entertain it. Other than that, he's still safe.

Garth Vader · #8 (**permalink**) Thu Mar 10, 2011, 11:28am

the plate umpire saw that the base umpire missed the call, that is missed the first swipe that got the bag. he should have informed me and we should have gotten the call right.

bob jenkins · #9 (**permalink**) Thu Mar 10, 2011, 01:11pm

(Many posts removed).

I'll give the new guy the benefit of the doubt, but actions like those deleted stop here.

MrUmpire · #10 (**permalink**) Thu Mar 10, 2011, 01:43pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

(Many posts removed).

I'll give the new guy the benefit of the doubt, but actions like those deleted stop here.

Start the clock.

bob jenkins · #11 (**permalink**) Thu Mar 10, 2011, 01:15pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garth Vader

the plate umpire saw that the base umpire missed the call, that is missed the first swipe that got the bag. he should have informed me and we should have gotten the call right.

It's definitely (imo) not PU's job to interject himself in this play.

If there was R1 only, PU would be heading to third (under new CCA mechanics, and those sometimes used in other levels). He'd likely not have a good view of the play.

If there was R3 as well, then PU is likely watching the tag at the plate.

If you asked him, he should give you what he had, but it's not likely to be much.

Getting the call right is important. Getting it right the right way is also important -- and not every call can be "got right", especially in 2-person.