Asking to see the ball

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by RogersUmp

What about when there are two outs? The catcher makes the tag with his glove, you don't see the ball in his glove because of the cloud from the slide, he gets up and starts to run off the field and you signal out while the ball is lying on the ground. If he doesn't have the ball and doesn't realize it he is not going to be thinking about another play. I ask for it when I need to see it. If he can't show me he doesn't have it.

The problem with this is (as was posted in a previous thread) what if the catcher pulls the ball out from under him (he is laying on his glove) with his bare hand? Did he really have the ball or did he pull it out from under his body?

A good player will always show the ball in the glove but when he cannot or does not, it is the umpire's job to find the ball. Standing 5 feet away hollering "show me the ball" will get you into trouble sooner or later.

[johnnyg08]

I think we're always looking for the ball...while looking for the ball, I am watching F2 to give me clues as to where the ball is. I'm not closing my eyes saying show me the ball.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Incorrect. It's only "false timing" if you have no legitimate reason to wait, and there's nothing legitimate to signal. Pointing in this case signals a tag before the runner reached the plate, and we wait to verify that the fielder has the ball. Otherwise, you could just signal an out.

Not proper mechanics. A tag play where no force is possible is not to be pointed at. As stated, the point on a tag is only to differentiate between "on the tag" and "on the force."

Originally Posted by mbyron

Pointing is correct in the situation you reference. But it is also correct on a force play where the fielder has held the bag long enough and then comes off: "he had the bag (pointing)... he's out (signaling the out)."

Yes, it is appropriate to point in this case too. I didn't say it wasn't. There are times when pointing is the right thing to do (like pointing to interference or obstruction, or awarding bases, for example).

What I said was that it isn't proper on a tag play where no force is possible. Which is correct, according to pro school teaching (unless something has drastically changed lately). You see a tag, watch the rest of the play, and at the very end you signal "out," either in a banger call or routine call, depending on the play. You don't point.

Originally Posted by mbyron

You are of course free to do it as you like.

I do as is taught by professionals, which is not to point on routine tag plays in non-force situations. It just looks a lot sharper to wait and then make the Out call.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by Pensaump

There used to be this guy that umpired around here. He told a position player one time after a tag to "show me the ball, show me the ball," the kid showed him the ball and he called this runner safe.

That is pretty darn funny!

[Ump153]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

What I said was that it isn't proper on a tag play where no force is possible. Which is correct, according to pro school teaching (unless something has drastically changed lately). You see a tag, watch the rest of the play, and at the very end you signal "out," either in a banger call or routine call, depending on the play. You don't point.

I believe nothing has changed at the schools. You are correct.

[johnnyg08]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

That is pretty darn funny!

agree...that is funny