What would you call?

[LDUB]

Originally Posted by Matt

But how do you know if it's a rules issue? What if your partner knows the rule, but has adjudged the facts differently than you?

R2 and R1. I am PU, 3 balls on batter. F1 pitches and BU calls "that's a balk". I call the pitch a ball. BU then calls time and starts awarding bases. I was 99% sure he called a balk for not stopping. So I ask "are you calling a no stop balk?" He says yes so I say well the pitch was ball 4, batter and all other runners are advancing so we'll ignore the balk. He agreed and all was well. It was possible he was calling a balk for something before the pitch so I just had to ask. It wasn't a big deal at all.

[kylejt]

There's a proper procedure for getting calls right. It involves the manager either requesting help, or protesting the ruling. Failure to follow the proper protocol will, eventually, lead to chaos.

I work with rookie umpires (and managers) all the time. And yes, I'll let them blow rule interpretations, even though I'm 60' away. No problem. I'll put the blame squarely on the manager, if he doesn't hold up his end of the job.

But I do mostly LL, and I'm there to help EVERYONE get better. If a manager wants to do it the right way, great. If not, I'll school him(if he's open to it) after the game, and everyone gets a little smarter for it.

[UmpTTS43]

Originally Posted by kylejt

There's a proper procedure for getting calls right. It involves the manager either requesting help, or protesting the ruling. Failure to follow the proper protocol will, eventually, lead to chaos.

I work with rookie umpires (and managers) all the time. And yes, I'll let them blow rule interpretations, even though I'm 60' away. No problem. I'll put the blame squarely on the manager, if he doesn't hold up his end of the job.

But I do mostly LL, and I'm there to help EVERYONE get better. If a manager wants to do it the right way, great. If not, I'll school him(if he's open to it) after the game, and everyone gets a little smarter for it.

One of our jobs as umpires is acting as arbiters of the rules. If there is a misapplication of the rules, and I am certain about it, I will get together with my partner and enforce accordingly. He will still learn what he did wrong. By letting your partner "eat" his interpretation, it opens it up if it happens again in the same game, maybe to the other team. Maybe the other coach will know the rule and point it out. He points it out and you correct it. Now, the whole crew has lost credibility. Credibility can still be lost if you let the rule infraction go against one team and the other team knows it. If a rule is misapplied, and you know it, fix it immediately.

[jicecone]

Originally Posted by UmpTTS43

If a rule is misapplied, and you know it, fix it immediately.

The discussion here is not wether the rule was mis-applied because, once again, you are not going to know it until you converse with your partner. If your partner asks for help and you explain to him that his interpretation was incorrect, then the proper way would be to let him handle the correction. The TEAM has then rectified an incorrect application of the rules and nobody has been thrown under the bus. Of course one coach will think the TEAM is screwing him and the other will be saying "good job." But, thats baseball.

Its when the officiating TEAM, works as a TEAM, that this can be handled smoothly. if your partner elects not to correct his call then there is not much more you can do but get back to playing the . move on.

[PeteBooth]

I agree with jicecone 100%.

At THAT "moment" we do not KNOW what your partner saw or what rule interp is being questioned UNLESS your partner comes to you and then you can intervene.

As Jicecone said we need to act as a TEAM.

Allow the manager to do his job meaning "Lodge a protest" then we can get involved.

As mentioned ONCE we as umpires take it upon ourselves to ARBRITRARILY OVER-RULE one another or STEP IN WITHOUT being asked the floodagtes will open.


Pete Booth

[kylejt]

Originally Posted by UmpTTS43

One of our jobs as umpires is acting as arbiters of the rules. ....... If a rule is misapplied, and you know it, fix it immediately.

Again, there's a protocol on how these rule misapplications are handled. If you want to side step this, go ahead, but it's a slippery slope once you start doing this. There's a right way of "getting the call right", and that way should be followed by all concerned.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by LDUB

R2 and R1. I am PU, 3 balls on batter. F1 pitches and BU calls "that's a balk". I call the pitch a ball. BU then calls time and starts awarding bases. I was 99% sure he called a balk for not stopping. So I ask "are you calling a no stop balk?" He says yes so I say well the pitch was ball 4, batter and all other runners are advancing so we'll ignore the balk. He agreed and all was well. It was possible he was calling a balk for something before the pitch so I just had to ask. It wasn't a big deal at all.

But you were asking for clarification, not interjecting what you saw, so that you could both properly enforce the rules.

[umpjim]

Originally Posted by LDUB

R2 and R1. I am PU, 3 balls on batter. F1 pitches and BU calls "that's a balk". I call the pitch a ball. BU then calls time and starts awarding bases. I was 99% sure he called a balk for not stopping. So I ask "are you calling a no stop balk?" He says yes so I say well the pitch was ball 4, batter and all other runners are advancing so we'll ignore the balk. He agreed and all was well. It was possible he was calling a balk for something before the pitch so I just had to ask. It wasn't a big deal at all.

What other balk call would make a difference in this situation? I'm focused on FED so OBR has gone to the back of my brain.