Got me thinking

[johnnyg08]

There are lots of things not specifically covered in the OBR rule book...it's not in PBUC (the def of foul tip is in there with respect to a strike out where the ball might be caught or not) but that's all I could find there. I'd bet a shiny mythical quarter that J/R addresses this...and if I remember this was discussed at length on Rob Drake's old site and the pro guys on there said that if a foul tip were to be "caught" and remain live...it had to go off of F2's glove first...or, I suppose his bare hand...but if that's the case...you're going to have to make a catcher substitution as well.

[Dave Reed]

Originally Posted by Fritz

Ya think OBR could edit that in during the next edition?

And give us one less think to obsess over? No way.

Seriously, a ball hardly ever rebounds directly off the catcher's mask and is then caught. I've never seen it.

Consider that the folks that sometimes edit the OBR have just this year gotten around to better defining the path a runner may take between bases. (For years, OBR has said the runner has to follow a direct line between bases, and this phrasing of the rule meant that nearly every base runner was violating the rule as written.) Let's hope they give priority to improving the rules that are in use frequently.

[johnnyg08]

not a bad thought Dave Reed...and yes +1 to gross misunderstanding of the base line rule...

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by Fritz

Since the batted ball DID NOT go sharp and direct to the catcher's hands, you would think it now is classified as a Foul Ball because it touched something in foul territory (catcher's mask). And I can't find anything in OBR that says that a foul BALL is dead when it strikes a catcher's equipment - otherwise, that second portion of your OP (hits the mask on the way down) would kill it.

The ball in the second part of the OP was not classified as a FOUL BALL, it was classified as a FLY BALL. That's why it can hit the mask first, because the mask is considered part of the player's person, and does not kill the ball on a FLY BALL when it gets hit. A FLY BALL is not considered either fair or foul until it is either a CATCH or a NO CATCH.

That's all that needed to be said: The FLY BALL bounced off the catcher's mask, then was caught. Perfectly legal.

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by rei

Did you all go to law school or something?

It does seem that way sometimes, doesn't it?

[Nigel Tufnel]

In my day we use to call that a pop-up...
I can hear the call on the radio - Deep drive to Varitek , at the warning track , reaches up, off the mask and ....yes he got it...two away..

[Fritz]

Originally Posted by Dave Reed

Seriously, a ball hardly ever rebounds directly off the catcher's mask and is then caught. I've never seen it.

Well then, I hope it is another 12 years before I see it again then because I was behind the plate when it happened to me in June for the first time. Ball nicks the bat as batter swings (on 1-1 count I believe), deflects enough to miss the glove and hit the top part of the catcher's mask, pops almost straight up in the air about 15 feet, giving the catcher just enough time to toss the mask, look up and stick out his glove for the "3rd" out. I said "Foul, no catch" and explained to the DC that it was dead and foul as soon as it hit the mask. No real argument, but both my partner and I went to our books after the game because we were arguing, friendly, about where that rule would be found. To no avail -

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by Fritz

No real argument, but both my partner and I went to our books after the game because we were arguing, friendly, about where that rule would be found. To no avail -

I thought we established where the rule is found. Rule 2.00 FOUL TIP says that a deflection off the mask is not a catch unless the ball first touches the glove. Umpiring 101. The fact that the ball went 15 feet into the air was totally irrelevant. It could have gone 100 feet in the air, or fell straight back into the glove. Same result, foul ball. Not exactly rocket science here.

[johnnyg08]

I don't think that's what 2.0 says on MLB.com though...yes, it's regarding foul tip, I don't remember reading anything about going straight to the glove.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by johnnyg08

I don't think that's what 2.0 says on MLB.com though...yes, it's regarding foul tip, I don't remember reading anything about going straight to the glove.

Word for word from MLB.com (I have them on .pdf for quick reference):

A FOUL TIP is a batted ball that goes sharp and direct from the bat to the catcher’s hands and is legally caught. It is not a foul tip unless caught and any foul tip that is caught is a strike, and the ball is in play. It is not a catch if it is a rebound, unless the ball has first touched the catcher’s glove or hand.

[BigTex]

Originally Posted by johnnyg08

I don't think that's what 2.0 says on MLB.com though...yes, it's regarding foul tip, I don't remember reading anything about going straight to the glove.

From MLB.com rule book (my highlights):


A FOUL TIP is a batted ball that goes sharp and direct from the bat to the catcher’s hands and is legally caught. It is not a foul tip unless caught and any foul tip that is caught is a strike, and the ball is in play. It is not a catch if it is a rebound, unless the ball has first
touched the catcher’s glove or hand.

[BigTex]

Wow Steve, I would have beat you, but I highlighted more than you!

[johnnyg08]

There it is! Thanks for posting guys!

[SanDiegoSteve]

Tex,

Jinx, buy me a Coke.

[BigTex]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Tex,

Jinx, buy me a Coke.

A frosty cold one. You name the time and place.