Umpire Interference (NFHS Rules)??

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

One out. R2 at second base. B3 hits ground ball to F6. F6 throws the ball over F3's head and the throw is recovered by F9. F9 sees that R2 has rounded third and is heading toward home plate. F9 throws the ball to F2 who is standing on the first base side of the diamond on a line from third base through home plate approximately three (3) feet from home plate when he catches F9's throw. R2 is approximately ten (10) feet from home plate when F2 catches F9's throw and steps toward home plate to tag R2 out before he reaches home plate. The problem is: The PU is standing on home plate staring his feet not realizing that R2 is bearing down on home plate and F2 is trying to make a play on R2. F2 is blocked by the PU from tagging R2 and R2 is able to touch home plate.

What do we have?

MTD, Sr.

[BigTex]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

One out. R2 at second base. B3 hits ground ball to F6. F6 throws the ball over F3's head and the throw is recovered by F9. F9 sees that R2 has rounded third and is heading toward home plate. F9 throws the ball to F2 who is standing on the first base side of the diamond on a line from third base through home plate approximately three (3) feet from home plate when he catches F9's throw. R2 is approximately ten (10) feet from home plate when F2 catches F9's throw and steps toward home plate to tag R2 out before he reaches home plate. The problem is: The PU is standing on home plate staring his feet not realizing that R2 is bearing down on home plate and F2 is trying to make a play on R2. F2 is blocked by the PU from tagging R2 and R2 is able to touch home plate.

What do we have?

MTD, Sr.

A run scored and a $hithouse.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

What do we have?

One very stupid plate umpire.


What do I win?

[DG]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

The problem is: The PU is standing on home plate staring his feet not realizing that R2 is bearing down on home plate and F2 is trying to make a play on R2. F2 is blocked by the PU from tagging R2 and R2 is able to touch home plate.

What do we have?

MTD, Sr.

You kidding, right? PU standing on the plate?

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by DG

You kidding, right? PU standing on the plate?

DG:

I kid you not, Mark, Jr. (an OhioHSAA umpire himself) was the F2 in the play. He told me it looked like the PU was trying to clean the plate with his shoes. After ten (10) minuates of discussion, the umpires put R2 back at third base. We knew this wasn't correct by rule because this was not umpire's interference by definition but the PU really screwed the pooch on this one.

One other thing, MTD, Jr. and I have looked and looked and looked and we have 't been able to find a single umpires' mail order business that sells plate shoes with brushes on them. I guess they are like bats that come with hands attached to them.

MTD, Sr.

[SAump]

R2 and R1. Ball hit into gap. R2 slides in safely past the plate and stands up right in front of the catcher. R1 was running behind R2 and slides in safely right after R2 pops up. The catcher makes no attempt to go around R2. Instead, he is trying to shove R2 out of the way to get to the plate. Now the defensive coach is yelling that R2 prevented F2 from tagging R1. The PU ruled in favor of R1 and tossed the coach after an endless argument about R2.

[justanotherblue]

An ejection due to umpire ignorance/failure

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

One other thing, MTD, Jr. and I have looked and looked and looked and we haven't been able to find a single umpires' mail order business that sells plate shoes with brushes on them.

You've never kicked the dirt off the plate with your shoes? Common practice when the plate isn't very dirty. But not in the middle of a play at the plate for heaven's sake.

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

One out. R2 at second base. B3 hits ground ball to F6. F6 throws the ball over F3's head and the throw is recovered by F9. F9 sees that R2 has rounded third and is heading toward home plate. F9 throws the ball to F2 who is standing on the first base side of the diamond on a line from third base through home plate approximately three (3) feet from home plate when he catches F9's throw. R2 is approximately ten (10) feet from home plate when F2 catches F9's throw and steps toward home plate to tag R2 out before he reaches home plate. The problem is: The PU is standing on home plate staring his feet not realizing that R2 is bearing down on home plate and F2 is trying to make a play on R2. F2 is blocked by the PU from tagging R2 and R2 is able to touch home plate.

What do we have?

MTD, Sr.

We do not have Umpire interference. Interference by an umpire can only occur in 2 ways:

1. The plate umpire interferes with the catcher's attempt to retire a runner.
2. A batted ball strikes an umpire before the ball travels past a fielder (other than the pitcher).

Corrections to common misconceptions:

• A thrown ball that hits an umpire is a dead ball.
  • A thrown ball that hits an umpire is live and in play.
• If a player runs into an umpire while attempting to field a batted or thrown ball, the ball is dead.
  • If a player runs into an umpire while attempting to field a batted or thrown ball, the ball is live and in play.
• If a player runs into an umpire while attempting to make a play on a runner, the ball is dead.
  • If a player runs into an umpire while attempting to make a play on a runner, the ball is live and in play.

The original post states that the umpire was standing on home plate and interfered with a play. As others have stated, this is simply tough cookies and a total $hit-house! If an umpire is stupid enough to put himself into a play, then he deserves to be fed a nice, fat $hit-burger from the managers!

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

MTD, Jr. and I agree with everybody that, by definition, this play was NOT umpire interference and was definitely a most excellent case of umpire stupidity. Having said that, just about every sport has the "God" rule:

BASKETBALL: NCAA R2-S3 (Elastic Power): "The referee shall be empowered to make decisions on any points not specifically covered in the rules." and NFHS R2-S3 (Referee’s Authority): "The referee shall make decisions on any points not specifically covered in the rules.

BASEBALL: NFHS R10-S2-A3g: "The Umpire-in-Chief duties include: make the final decisionon points not covered in the rules."

Therefore I submit to my learned brethern of this forum, could the UIC have invoked R10-S2-A3g as the reason for putting R1 back on third base?

MTD, Sr.

[Stan16]

"not specifically covered in the rules"

Says nothing about not being covered in the Case Book.

No interference (by rule) and soon to be clear evidence of global warming at home plate.

Why is this even being debated?

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Therefore I submit to my learned brethern of this forum, could the UIC have invoked R10-S2-A3g as the reason for putting R1 back on third base?

He could have, of course, but doing so would be illegitimate.

You see, umpire interference IS covered in the rules. This was not an instance of it. To apply 10-2-3, you'd be insisting that this was umpire interference, contrary to the rule.

10-2-3 is for situations that really, really aren't in the rule book, e.g., pitch hits a bird in flight. You can't call a ball or strike, and the pitch was legal, so what do you do?

Never invoke 10-2-3 (or 9.01c in OBR) simply because you don't like what the other rules count or omit as an infraction.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Guys, I agree that this is not umpire interference but if I was the BU in this game I would be trying to find a way to help my stupid a$$ idiotic numb nut PU out of a jam that gives one team an advantage to which they are not entitled to by rule. That is why I brought up NFHS R1-S2-A3g. I think we all agree that this umpire was really asleep at the wheel.

But the PU in this game is indicative of the type of unpires in this league. Last night the BU never once watched the B/R to see if he touched first base as he rounded the base. Twice the B/R missed first base and he didn't see it. When the appeal was made in the first instance he didn't have a clue as to what call to make. The second time B/R missed first base he hit a "ground double". A dead ball appeal was made and he said he didn't know if the B/R touched first base but it didn't matter because he had awarded the B/R second base because of the "ground double." And even after the second appeal he still hadn't learned that he should be watching the B/R. Thank goodness I don't umpire with these guys because none of them umpire high school baseball.

MTD, Sr.

[rookieblue]

Never invoke 10-2-3 (or 9.01c in OBR) simply because you don't like what the other rules count or omit as an infraction.

Amen, brother!!

Stan, that was pretty funny.

[MrUmpire]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Guys, I agree that this is not umpire interference but if I was the BU in this game I would be trying to find a way to help my stupid a$$ idiotic numb nut PU out of a jam that gives one team an advantage to which they are not entitled to by rule. That is why I brought up NFHS R1-S2-A3g.
MTD, Sr.

R1-S2-A3g is only used when a situation is not covered by rule. Umpire interference is covered by rule. We don't use R1-S2-A3g to augment an existing rule.

Some partners can't be helped. Play on.