Going Solo

[CO ump]

Originally Posted by GarthB

No, what I'm saying is that in the few one man games that I have done, and the in the one man games for which I train umpires, at the conclusion of play, if the umpire has had to come out make a call, the ball is now dead as he jogs back to the plate, without him calling time.

The reason is what I stated before, to keep the flow going and to discourage additional activites of the coaches and players that would delay putting the ball in play.

And IF, some numb nut decides create a play situation while the umpire is jobbing back to the plate, the umpire would put things back as they were, just as he would if time had been called.

The result is no different than if he had called time after every play, except the game will be ten miuntes shorter.

If you have a problem with working Frosh one man games in this manner, then don't.

First off this is a forum where mechanics, rules, rule interps and umpire stuff is discussed and hopefully some learning takes place. The next time I or some one else posts an incorrect mechanic or a bad rules interp you will be one of the first to correct it.
I'm sure many new and inexperienced umps are reading your posts, and so they should, you're probably one of the top 5 knowledgeable and experienced guys on the board, which is why I was surprised when you stated that turning your back on a live ball was ok.

I'm very confused over your explanation. The ball is either dead or it's live, there's no middle ground. If the ball is dead it must be put back in play.
If you teach that the ball is automatically dead when you turn your back so be it. But it is an improper mechanic, or lack of mechanic and no one but you knows the ball is dead.

And why in the world would a kid be a numb nut for creating a play during live ball action? I don't remember ever being taught to make sure the ump is watching before advancing, there's nothing in the rules that obligates the player to wait for the umpire during live ball action.
You would be the numb nut for not calling time.
I think you're teaching terrible mechanics and creating a real opportunity for a crap house for what? To maybe save 5 minutes.

Garth you may have the skills and presence on the field to handle the coach when you have to send a runner back or deny an out by the defense that was made while the ball was live and your back was turned. But you teach and have influence over many new and inexperienced umps who have not developed the same game management skills that you have and your endorsement and teaching of this terrible mechanic isn't helping them.

Teaching improper mechanics for the sake of getting off the field quicker isn't something I expected from you

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by CO ump

So, you disagree with the way we perform one-man mechanics when we are forced to do at a sub varsity level? I can live with that.

[CO ump]

Originally Posted by GarthB

So, you disagree with the way we perform one-man mechanics when we are forced to do at a sub varsity level? I can live with that.

Most umps doing sub varsity are on their way up the ladder not taking a temporary step down. Therefore, I think we agree, they need to be learning proper mechanics, not shortcuts to getting off the field 5 minutes quicker.

[PeteBooth]

[QUOTE]

Originally Posted by CO ump

The ball is either dead or it's live, there's no middle ground. If the ball is dead it must be put back in play.

By definition only you are correct but not in actual practice.

If you watch MLB when b1 walks and the manager wants to make a pitching change, the manger is already on his way to the mound before TIME is called. It's called MLB protocol. There are also other instances as well.

When working SOLO I do my best to back peddle when I am near the "working area" making a call.

Keep the game moving.

Also, IMO you are missing the BIG picture It's a modified / JV or Frosh game. If we go by what you recommend you will be calling TIME on just about every play which adds as Garth said at the very minimum 10-15 minutes and in some instances more.

The coaches know you are working SOLO and if your back is turned while jogging back to the plate it is in effect TIME without calling it.

Also, one other thing to remember. You are not going to jog back to the plate until action is relaxed on the previous play. After action is relaxed, as Garth says if the coach now "wants to play games" when your back is turned, then you simply put things back.

If you want to call TIME so be it but that's your preference, all Garth and myself are pointing out is that there is another way it is not necessarily the wrong way.

When working SOLO TIME will be called enough. Sometimes we ourselves take an extra minute or 2 in between innings if we just got finished with a marathon and need that minute or 2 to catch our breaths and keep up with the liquids.

Pete Booth

[CO ump]

[QUOTE=PeteBooth]

By definition only you are correct but not in actual practice.

If you watch MLB when b1 walks and the manager wants to make a pitching change, the manger is already on his way to the mound before TIME is called. It's called MLB protocol. There are also other instances as well.

yes but in each instance the ball is put back in play


[QUOTE=PeteBooth]

Also, IMO you are missing the BIG picture It's a modified / JV or Frosh game. If we go by what you recommend you will be calling TIME on just about every play which adds as Garth said at the very minimum 10-15 minutes and in some instances more.

I disagree. This is only an issue when there is a runner or runners on base. I can take an angle back to the plate and keep my eye on a single runner.
The only instance time needs to be called, if you don't turn your back on a single runner, is when there are multiple runners which is a small percentage of the time.

[QUOTE=PeteBooth]

The coaches know you are working SOLO and if your back is turned while jogging back to the plate it is in effect TIME without calling it.

So when we're solo the coaches are our friends and suddenly grow a brain and develop a sense of fairness. If that's the case all games should be solo




[QUOTE=PeteBooth]

If you want to call TIME so be it but that's your preference, all Garth and myself are pointing out is that there is another way it is not necessarily the wrong way.

If you want to say that when you turn your back the ball is dead that's fine, but then the ball has to be put back in play.
To leave the ball live, but not allow live ball action is wrong. To make the ball dead and not have a definitive time when the ball becomes live again can only lead to trouble.
And if the only reason you're not calling time is to get to the local watering hole quicker then IMO you're cheating the game.
I also have an issue with umps who don't seem to give their best efforts to underclass games. But that's another issue altogether

[QUOTE=PeteBooth]

When working SOLO TIME will be called enough.

Except for the issue at hand, why would time be called anymore than in a 2 or 3 man game?

[UmpJM]

As a "rookie" last season, I got mostly "lower level" assignments which, in the area I live (Chicago suburbs) are unfortunately primarily one umpire games. So, over 60% of the games I worked last year were "solo".

Now, like Garth, I am loathe to call "Time" unles there is a reason to because it "slows down" and legthens the game.

However, like CO_Ump, I do not believe that there is a "sort of dead" condition for the ball. It's either in play or it's not. If it's in play, the offense's runners may attempt to advance and the defense may attempt to put out a runner.

My practice when working solo after I have come into the field to rule on a play is to wait until the action "relaxes" while continuing to face the ball. When the fielder with the ball starts to throw it to the pitcher, I start to jog back to the plate while "looking over my shoulder" at the ball/player with the ball.

On the handful of occasions where the defense initiated a play while I was returning to the plate area, I simply stopped, pivoted to the action, and ruled on the play.

This seemed to work fine for me.

If I found myself "far away" from the plate when action relaxed (say at the 2B cutout after taking the runner into 2B on a "stretch double") I would call Time when action relaxed then hustle back to the plate and explicitly put the ball back in play when the conditions for doing so were met.

JM