Going Solo

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by CO ump

johnny
If I said I use my left hand to signal strikes, you think you, Garth and few others might have a comment for me?
If I said I point to my partner with my right hand on an appeal and that's the best way to do it, I might get some feedback?
If I said I didn't like the pivot move and instead stayed on the outside because I got better angles, you think I might catch some flak?

So my question is What difference does it make to you?

It's a forum where opinions are shared and crtiques are given with or without permission and many umpires especially newer ones benefit.
Without going into the archives I'll venture to guess that Garth has many times corrected a stated rules interp or corrected a mechanic, not to show up the original poster but to make sure the umps reading the post are not misled.
It's the beauty of this forum that improper mechanics and bad rule interps ususally get vetted.

I'm sorry you're offended but bad mechanics are bad mechanics no matter who's performing or promoting them. If you disagree then say so but if you don't want to be critiqued then don't announce on the board what you're doing.

I will contine to teach our umpires, that when faced with working one-man, instead of cancelling the game, work it to the best of your ability withn the limitation, hustle at the end of plays, without calling time, to get back to the plate so that you can get the game in before dusk. And, if someone tries to create a play situation, kill it and put everything back where it was...where it would be if time HAD been called, so that there is no difference in the outcome of the integrity of the game.

If I've disappointed you, I'm sorry. But I cannot get too excited about someone not agreeing with so-called "one man mechanics" used at a Frosh game.

If you want to compare that to misinterpreting rules that affect the integerity of the game at all levels, or missing a rotation or being out of position for a call you're reaching. Nothing in the way we work one man games results in the game ending any differently than it would using other "one-man" mechanics.

This much ado about nothing.

[CO ump]

Originally Posted by GarthB

If I've disappointed you, I'm sorry. But I cannot get too excited about someone not agreeing with so-called "one man mechanics" used at a Frosh game.

I'm not excited nor do I expect you to be, but I do think the freshman deserve as good an effort as any other level.

Originally Posted by GarthB

If you want to compare that to.... being out of position for a call you're reaching.

Actually when you turn your back on a live ball you are out of position

Originally Posted by GarthB

Nothing in the way we work one man games results in the game ending any differently than it would using other "one-man" mechanics.

This much ado about nothing.

It's nothing until a crap storm hits because an ump is denying a team an earned advantage because you turned your back on a live ball.

However you can avoid that by covering this in pregame:

"Coaches, I'm out here by myself so when I turn my back to go home the ball is dead, well kinda dead because I'm not going to put it back in play but if anything happens while my back is turned we're gonna play it like it was dead and just because I turn back around doesn't mean I'm ready, I might be wiping sweat off my brow and not yet focused or maybe putting my mask on and not ready to watch a snap throw, so the kids are just going to have to guess as to when play starts again because calling time and pointing the ball back in play is too much effort, you do know I'm out here by myself?
Let me assure you this is for your benefit not mine, you'll thank me when the game's over."

Yep I think if you covered it in pregame you'd be good to go!

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by CO ump

I'm not excited nor do I expect you to be, but I do think the freshman deserve as good an effort as any other level.

Then they should have paid for two umpires.

I'm sorry...when I said this is "much ado about nothing" I misspoke. I should have said "this is very much ado about nothing."

Wow.

[PeteBooth]

[QUOTE]

Originally Posted by CO ump

The ball is either dead or it's live, there's no middle ground. If the ball is dead it must be put back in play.

By definition only you are correct but not in actual practice.

If you watch MLB when b1 walks and the manager wants to make a pitching change, the manger is already on his way to the mound before TIME is called. It's called MLB protocol. There are also other instances as well.

When working SOLO I do my best to back peddle when I am near the "working area" making a call.

Keep the game moving.

Also, IMO you are missing the BIG picture It's a modified / JV or Frosh game. If we go by what you recommend you will be calling TIME on just about every play which adds as Garth said at the very minimum 10-15 minutes and in some instances more.

The coaches know you are working SOLO and if your back is turned while jogging back to the plate it is in effect TIME without calling it.

Also, one other thing to remember. You are not going to jog back to the plate until action is relaxed on the previous play. After action is relaxed, as Garth says if the coach now "wants to play games" when your back is turned, then you simply put things back.

If you want to call TIME so be it but that's your preference, all Garth and myself are pointing out is that there is another way it is not necessarily the wrong way.

When working SOLO TIME will be called enough. Sometimes we ourselves take an extra minute or 2 in between innings if we just got finished with a marathon and need that minute or 2 to catch our breaths and keep up with the liquids.

Pete Booth

[CO ump]

[QUOTE=PeteBooth]

By definition only you are correct but not in actual practice.

If you watch MLB when b1 walks and the manager wants to make a pitching change, the manger is already on his way to the mound before TIME is called. It's called MLB protocol. There are also other instances as well.

yes but in each instance the ball is put back in play


[QUOTE=PeteBooth]

Also, IMO you are missing the BIG picture It's a modified / JV or Frosh game. If we go by what you recommend you will be calling TIME on just about every play which adds as Garth said at the very minimum 10-15 minutes and in some instances more.

I disagree. This is only an issue when there is a runner or runners on base. I can take an angle back to the plate and keep my eye on a single runner.
The only instance time needs to be called, if you don't turn your back on a single runner, is when there are multiple runners which is a small percentage of the time.

[QUOTE=PeteBooth]

The coaches know you are working SOLO and if your back is turned while jogging back to the plate it is in effect TIME without calling it.

So when we're solo the coaches are our friends and suddenly grow a brain and develop a sense of fairness. If that's the case all games should be solo




[QUOTE=PeteBooth]

If you want to call TIME so be it but that's your preference, all Garth and myself are pointing out is that there is another way it is not necessarily the wrong way.

If you want to say that when you turn your back the ball is dead that's fine, but then the ball has to be put back in play.
To leave the ball live, but not allow live ball action is wrong. To make the ball dead and not have a definitive time when the ball becomes live again can only lead to trouble.
And if the only reason you're not calling time is to get to the local watering hole quicker then IMO you're cheating the game.
I also have an issue with umps who don't seem to give their best efforts to underclass games. But that's another issue altogether

[QUOTE=PeteBooth]

When working SOLO TIME will be called enough.

Except for the issue at hand, why would time be called anymore than in a 2 or 3 man game?

[UmpJM]

As a "rookie" last season, I got mostly "lower level" assignments which, in the area I live (Chicago suburbs) are unfortunately primarily one umpire games. So, over 60% of the games I worked last year were "solo".

Now, like Garth, I am loathe to call "Time" unles there is a reason to because it "slows down" and legthens the game.

However, like CO_Ump, I do not believe that there is a "sort of dead" condition for the ball. It's either in play or it's not. If it's in play, the offense's runners may attempt to advance and the defense may attempt to put out a runner.

My practice when working solo after I have come into the field to rule on a play is to wait until the action "relaxes" while continuing to face the ball. When the fielder with the ball starts to throw it to the pitcher, I start to jog back to the plate while "looking over my shoulder" at the ball/player with the ball.

On the handful of occasions where the defense initiated a play while I was returning to the plate area, I simply stopped, pivoted to the action, and ruled on the play.

This seemed to work fine for me.

If I found myself "far away" from the plate when action relaxed (say at the 2B cutout after taking the runner into 2B on a "stretch double") I would call Time when action relaxed then hustle back to the plate and explicitly put the ball back in play when the conditions for doing so were met.

JM

Originally Posted by GarthB

No, what I'm saying is that in the few one man games that I have done, and the in the one man games for which I train umpires, at the conclusion of play, if the umpire has had to come out make a call, the ball is now dead as he jogs back to the plate, without him calling time.

The reason is what I stated before, to keep the flow going and to discourage additional activites of the coaches and players that would delay putting the ball in play.

And IF, some numb nut decides create a play situation while the umpire is jobbing back to the plate, the umpire would put things back as they were, just as he would if time had been called.

The result is no different than if he had called time after every play, except the game will be ten miuntes shorter.

If you have a problem with working Frosh one man games in this manner, then don't.

Ninety percent of the games I've worked in the last two years alone have been solo, by choice. I've never turned my back on a live ball. Either time has been called or I back pedal to home. Does it take more time, certainly; is it a pain in the a$$, you bet. I'd rather take an extra 20 - 30 seconds than to place myself in a vulnerable spot and have to explain to a coach, I didn't see it because I wasn't watching. Sorry, I can't agree with your point of view. If you are getting paid to call a game solo, you owe every player, coach and spectator the same courtesy of being attentive at all times as much as you would if you were doing two, three, or four man.

[MrUmpire]

Originally Posted by SAump

Yes the ball is still live but I don't have to watch the ball after the play has been made.

The runner never ever advances to the next base. I just don't allow TWP to occur when I am not watching.
I call the play safe or out and I turn around and head home.

I think this is what Garth is saying. I agree with you both.

[Interested Ump]

Originally Posted by SAump

Yes the ball is still live but I don't have to watch the ball after the play has been made. Most of the time the fielders throw the ball around the infield after an out has been made or get the ball back into the pitcher. The runner never ever advances to the next base. I just don't allow TWP to occur when I am not watching.

I doubt it will make any difference, congrats on your best efforts, but with Moms coaching...who else throws the ball around the infield with Rs?

I call the play safe or out and I turn around and head home. I never once considered backpedaling back to my position. Its just too far and too "dumb-looking" for anyone to back pedal 60 to 100 feet back to the plate. If I saw someone I know doing it, I would probably say, "Don't do that."

Like catching up with a fast break, a few backpedals led by a proper shoulder turn...which can be squared" to see the playing field..

No one should teach anyone else to back pedal. Its just bad fundamentals. Period.

I would argue but you have your head firmly in sand...er, concrete..no, made up on tis subject.

[rngrck]

Well guys, interesting points of view on this subject I first brought up. I've done 4 solo games this week and all went rather smoothly. I did my homework well in the pre-game advising the coaches of what I'd be looking for and expected their cooperation. It worked!!! As far as calling time, i used my judgement rather then calling it every time after a play. If there was lots of action going on with multiple runners, I called it. Otherwise, I watched the infielders throw to the mound and just let it alone. Overall I must have done ok, since I got alot of positive feedback all week from the coaches, players and fans!!