another running lane decision

[btdt]

During state playoffs last spring. R3, 2 out, ground ball to F-6 which F-6 fumbles around a bit and then makes a bad throw to first which pulls F-3 off the bag toward the plate.

Of course there is a collision and I have the runner safe.

Plate umpire calls time and call B/R out/interference for being out of running lane. Run does not count.

I did not agree but it was U-1 call.

My interpretation of the rule is for throws coming from behind the runner, not errant throws from F-6.

The call had an effect on who went to the state finals as the runner from third scored, but interference negated that run.

[Rich Ives]

Originally Posted by btdt

During state playoffs last spring. R3, 2 out, ground ball to F-6 which F-6 fumbles around a bit and then makes a bad throw to first which pulls F-3 off the bag toward the plate.

Of course there is a collision and I have the runner safe.

Plate umpire calls time and call B/R out/interference for being out of running lane. Run does not count.

I did not agree but it was U-1 call.

My interpretation of the rule is for throws coming from behind the runner, not errant throws from F-6.

The call had an effect on who went to the state finals as the runner from third scored, but interference negated that run.

In OBR there's a ruling from the PBUC that the throw need not come from the plate area.

[bobbybanaduck]

day game or night game?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Rich Ives

In OBR there's a ruling from the PBUC that the throw need not come from the plate area.

Good thing I've never seen that, cause it would be a cold, cold day before I'd make that call.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by bobbybanaduck

day game or night game?

Dammit. You beat me.

[bobbybanaduck]

Originally Posted by btdt

During state playoffs last spring. R3, 2 out, ground ball to F-6 which F-6 fumbles around a bit and then makes a bad throw to first which pulls F-3 off the bag toward the plate.

Of course there is a collision and I have the runner safe.

Plate umpire calls time and call B/R out/interference for being out of running lane. Run does not count.

I did not agree but it was U-1 call.

My interpretation of the rule is for throws coming from behind the runner, not errant throws from F-6.

The call had an effect on who went to the state finals as the runner from third scored, but interference negated that run.

the answer to your question lies inside your post. i made it big for you. the defense erred when they made a bad throw. the runner should not be called out for a runner's lane violation on an errant throw. it's not his fault F6 threw it up the line.

[bobbybanaduck]

Originally Posted by GarthB

Dammit. You beat me.

i'm quick like that.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

Good thing I've never seen that, cause it would be a cold, cold day before I'd make that call.

Well now, I've umpired in some pretty nippley weather before, and I still wouldn't dream of making such a call!

You can't penalize the BR because F6 can't throw straight.

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by btdt

During state playoffs last spring. R3, 2 out, ground ball to F-6 which F-6 fumbles around a bit and then makes a bad throw to first which pulls F-3 off the bag toward the plate.

Of course there is a collision and I have the runner safe.

Plate umpire calls time and call B/R out/interference for being out of running lane. Run does not count.

I did not agree but it was U-1 call.

My interpretation of the rule is for throws coming from behind the runner, not errant throws from F-6.

The call had an effect on who went to the state finals as the runner from third scored, but interference negated that run.

WHAT?!?

Umm, a discussion should have ensued between you and your partner so you could have instructed him quietly that he was very, very wrong in making a call like this!

[Rich Ives]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

Good thing I've never seen that, cause it would be a cold, cold day before I'd make that call.

Sorry, I didn't mean it should be applied to this particular play. I was only trying to comment on where the throw originates.

[gordon30307]

Originally Posted by btdt

During state playoffs last spring. R3, 2 out, ground ball to F-6 which F-6 fumbles around a bit and then makes a bad throw to first which pulls F-3 off the bag toward the plate.

Of course there is a collision and I have the runner safe.

Plate umpire calls time and call B/R out/interference for being out of running lane. Run does not count.

I did not agree but it was U-1 call.

My interpretation of the rule is for throws coming from behind the runner, not errant throws from F-6.

The call had an effect on who went to the state finals as the runner from third scored, but interference negated that run.

1. UIC can't overrule you. It's your call all the way. By the way you're correct.

2. How did UIC get a playoff game? Most Rookies know this rule. Baseball 101.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by Rich Ives

In OBR there's a ruling from the PBUC that the throw need not come from the plate area.

PBUC evaluators will tell you that while that is true, it should not be interpreted as meaning the throw can come from anywhere.

The rule came about when the the first base bag straddled the base line. The inside portion "belonged" to the fielder, the outside. The rule was to protect the fielder's opportunity to field a throw from the plate and area between the mound and home, not to necessarily restrict the runner.

The comment from PBUC that "expanded" from where the throw could orginate was meant to include the mound and the areas of infield where the angle of a quality throw could still result in the runner interfering with the opporutnity of the fielder to field the throw.

A direct throw from F4 and most throws from F5 and F6 are still not ingredients to invoke this rule, at least in the mind of the evaluator I spoke with, and is certainly not included in what is taught at proschool.

[TussAgee11]

Here, the runner isn't out for leaving the runner's lane, he could be called out for leaving the baseline while a play is being made on him (unlikely because there was a collision) or for malicious contact in FED/NCAA. The only was I see a runner's lane violation is if it is blatantly obvious to U1 and everyone else in the park. PU should not be splitting hairs here though.

Here is an NCAA bulletin regarding the situation a similar situation. The situation is the first clip.

[Rich Ives]

Originally Posted by GarthB

PBUC evaluators will tell you that while that is true, it should not be interpreted as meaning the throw can come from anywhere.

The rule came about when the the first base bag straddled the base line. The inside portion "belonged" to the fielder, the outside. The rule was to protect the fielder's opportunity to field a throw from the plate and area between the mound and home, not to necessarily restrict the runner.

The comment from PBUC that "expanded" from where the throw could orginate was meant to include the mound and the areas of infield where the angle of a quality throw could still result in the runner interfering with the opporutnity of the fielder to field the throw.

A direct throw from F4 and most throws from F5 and F6 are still not ingredients to invoke this rule, at least in the mind of the evaluator I spoke with, and is certainly not included in what is taught at proschool.

When CC first reported the ruling he had a major hissy fit about it. The first time it was in the BRD there was considerable "editorial comment" - since removed. The impression I got back then was that the throw could come from anywhere, and I think I remember that there was an additional comment from Fitzpatrick on the order of not giving the runner license to crash into the fielder.

If F3 or F4 is throwing, from beyond the base, to F1 covering, do you not want to protect the fielder?

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by Rich Ives

If F3 or F4 is throwing, from beyond the base, to F1 covering, do you not want to protect the fielder?

We're are talking about a running lane violation here, i.e. the runner, by the act of being out of the running lane interfering with the fielder's opportunity to field the ball. You'll need to do a better job of creating a TWP of a throw coming from the outfield side of first being interfered with by a runner on the home side of first.