What would be your call?

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Okay, here we go again. Yeah, we know you could have been a major league umpire....you've told us numerous times.

Hey Garth, I'm not supposed to say anything about that (because of your direct ridicule), but if you are going to open that one back up, then I will reinterate again:

Sorry, Steve, I took your post for heading in that ridiculous direction again. Coulda, woulda, shoulda...meaningless absent action.

I have been top graduate in the military, several trade schools, and will be graduating from a prestigious graphic design school Magna Cum Laude in March.

Congratulations. Now according to your logic and arguments, someone who graduated by the skin of the teeth, say with a D- could claim to be Magna Cum Laude and you wouldn't care.

So when I say that I would have graduated in the top 10 of a 150 student umpire school class, that is exactly what would have happened. I do very well when I apply myself.

It's obvious you believe that, Steve.

But these posts haven't been about that...these posts have been about deceptively listing credentials...or in other words, lying.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by GarthB

Congratulations. Now according to your logic and arguments, someone who graduated by the skin of the teeth, say with a D- could claim to be Magna Cum Laude and you wouldn't care.

People are all the time lying on their résumés. Although I disapprove of this dispicable practice, it does happen and I am powerless to stop it.

Like I said, I took his signature to merely indicate the levels of baseball and softball that he has worked, not as any insult to card-carrying AMLU members. You know me, Public Defender Steve.

I guess that some of us feel differently about it than you do. He is obviously proud of the fact that he has worked some minor league baseball. That is something to be proud of for most people. Over 99% if all umpires worldwide cannot make that claim. I would count it as a major umpiring accomplishment to have worked as a sub in the minors.

Perhaps he should state "Levels worked:" in front of the various levels of ball to indicate that he is not a current full-time minor league umpire.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

I guess that some of us feel differently about it than you do.

I know of at least seven posters here who have worked as fill-ins at the MiLB level. How many do you see listing that on a signature resume?

Those who feel differently, for the most part, are those who think it's okay to be deceptive.

He is obviously proud of the fact that he has worked some minor league baseball. That is something to be proud of for most people. Over 99% if all umpires worldwide cannot make that claim. I would count it as a major umpiring accomplishment to have worked as a sub in the minors.

Quite often it is more of being in the right place at the right time. I filled in once when the plate umpire went down during the game. Why me? One of the front office guys knew I was there watching the game and they didn't have to wait for someone to get to the ballpark.

Perhaps he should state "Levels worked:" in front of the various levels of ball to indicate that he is not a current full-time minor league umpire.

The honest description would be "MiLB, Fill-in".

In reality, he is only fooling the truly unknowing. Anyone who understands umpiring wrote him off when he included MiLB and ASA in the same breath.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by GarthB

Quite often it is more of being in the right place at the right time. I filled in once when the plate umpire went down during the game. Why me? One of the front office guys knew I was there watching the game and they didn't have to wait for someone to get to the ballpark.

Oh, okay. I don't live near any minor league baseball, so I don't know how it works. If I lived near Lake Elsinore I would probably have been hanging around there all this time waiting for my shot.

[canadaump6]

Maybe it's because I don't umpire in the professional system, but I don't see putting MiLB in one's signature as disrespecting umpires who make a living at that level. He just happened to put it in his signature. The umpire's role is to put up with a lot of abuse, so I'm sure most MiLB umpires wouldn't care if someone claimed to be a member of their association.

But Steve, making the claim that you would have made the big leagues had you had the drive to do so is a bit much. We've all got potential in certain domains. You don't get any results unless you use that potential. As an example, I am a gifted saxophone player- I started in grade 7 and it only took a few lessons before my teacher knew I really had something going for me. I had a ton of success over the years (won a Kiwanis scholarship, accepted into grade 10 music course when in grade 9, etc.). But while I had natural abilities going for me, I never had the drive or enjoyment to stick with it. While I could claim that I could be a big name jazz star, doing so would be a huge disservice to the people who dedicate their lives to the profession.

The same goes for umpiring. You may be one hell of an umpire, but unless you have put in years upon years in the professional system, it's not fair to act as if making the big leagues is an easy thing to do.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by canadaump6

The umpire's role is to put up with a lot of abuse,

I've never seen that listed in any of the publications, and I certainly don't teach it.

[UmpLarryJohnson]

Cump6 if one subtracks your first paragraph and only reads the 2nd two thats the best post youve ever made.

[Richard_Siegel]

Originally Posted by canadaump6

The umpire's role is to put up with a lot of abuse,

The sooner you realize that this statement is wrong, the faster you will have better games!

The umpire's role is NOT to put up with a lot of abuse.

The umpire's role is to learn how to prevent abuse, to snuff out abuse if it happens, and how to punish those who abuse us. When you learn those three things you will never "put up with a lot of abuse," again.

We are not whipping boys.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by canadaump6

Maybe it's because I don't umpire in the professional system, but I don't see putting MiLB in one's signature as disrespecting umpires who make a living at that level. He just happened to put it in his signature. The umpire's role is to put up with a lot of abuse, so I'm sure most MiLB umpires wouldn't care if someone claimed to be a member of their association.

But Steve, making the claim that you would have made the big leagues had you had the drive to do so is a bit much. We've all got potential in certain domains. You don't get any results unless you use that potential. As an example, I am a gifted saxophone player- I started in grade 7 and it only took a few lessons before my teacher knew I really had something going for me. I had a ton of success over the years (won a Kiwanis scholarship, accepted into grade 10 music course when in grade 9, etc.). But while I had natural abilities going for me, I never had the drive or enjoyment to stick with it. While I could claim that I could be a big name jazz star, doing so would be a huge disservice to the people who dedicate their lives to the profession.

The same goes for umpiring. You may be one hell of an umpire, but unless you have put in years upon years in the professional system, it's not fair to act as if making the big leagues is an easy thing to do.

First, I have not one time acted as if making the big leagues is easy. I realize exactly the hard work it takes. I said that if I had gone to umpire school and gotten a pro job, then I would have eventually made the big leagues. This would have taken a lot of hard work as well as a great deal of breaks along the way, but it could have been done.

Next, I don't know how to put this any more politely, but you don't have a clue as to my umpiring abilities back in the 1980s, so please do not comment on the subject. I have over 3,000 baseball games umpired under my belt. When you come anywhere close to this experience then you can comment. I worked my a$$ off honing my skills in a much more strenuous environment than umpire school, which would have been like Club Med compared to the conditions I put myself through. I worked in excess of 200 games a year in most years, 6 and 7 days a week, including many solo 90' triple-headers on the weekends. And all that time I was receiving instructions from some very knowledgable pro school grads and minor league umpires.

I know that I would have been a success in umpire school, and all that counts is that I know it, not anyone else. Everyone has already taken their potshots at me for revealing my feelings on the subject, but I'll be damned if I'm going to listen to some wet-behind-the-ears kid make remarks too. I have gone through more chest protectors and plate shoes than you have years on this earth.

Now, I didn't bring the subject up, Garth did. I know that I didn't go for it. Duh. That's kind of obvious. Yeah, I could have been an astronaut too if they only lowered the standards for entry in that program. We all "could have been" whatever we wanted under the right circumstances. If my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle. Of course, it should go without saying that nobody really knows what would have happened because I did not go. I had the money in to go, but needed the money for something else, so I blew it. Do I have regrets? Of course I do. That's probably why I opened myself up for ridicule to start with. But that was two years ago, and I really had hoped to get far beyond this subject.

Let's just put it this way: I was a far better umpire than several umpires who went to pro school and thought they were great, and who graduated near the top of their classes. Now that's the last I want to say about it or hear about it.

[bobbybanaduck]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

First, I have not one time acted as if making the big leagues is easy. I realize exactly the hard work it takes. I said that if I had gone to umpire school and gotten a pro job, then I would have eventually made the big leagues. This would have taken a lot of hard work as well as a great deal of breaks along the way, but it could have been done.

Next, I don't know how to put this any more politely, but you don't have a clue as to my umpiring abilities back in the 1980s, so please do not comment on the subject. I have over 3,000 baseball games umpired under my belt. When you come anywhere close to this experience then you can comment. I worked my a$$ off honing my skills in a much more strenuous environment than umpire school, which would have been like Club Med compared to the conditions I put myself through. I worked in excess of 200 games a year in most years, 6 and 7 days a week, including many solo 90' triple-headers on the weekends. And all that time I was receiving instructions from some very knowledgable pro school grads and minor league umpires.

I know that I would have been a success in umpire school, and all that counts is that I know it, not anyone else. Everyone has already taken their potshots at me for revealing my feelings on the subject, but I'll be damned if I'm going to listen to some wet-behind-the-ears kid make remarks too. I have gone through more chest protectors and plate shoes than you have years on this earth.

Now, I didn't bring the subject up, Garth did. I know that I didn't go for it. Duh. That's kind of obvious. Yeah, I could have been an astronaut too if they only lowered the standards for entry in that program. We all "could have been" whatever we wanted under the right circumstances. If my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle. Of course, it should go without saying that nobody really knows what would have happened because I did not go. I had the money in to go, but needed the money for something else, so I blew it. Do I have regrets? Of course I do. That's probably why I opened myself up for ridicule to start with. But that was two years ago, and I really had hoped to get far beyond this subject.

Let's just put it this way: I was a far better umpire than several umpires who went to pro school and thought they were great, and who graduated near the top of their classes. Now that's the last I want to say about it or hear about it.

haven't you made it abundantly clear that you can do anything you put your mind to? why, then, would they have to lower the standards???

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by bobbybanaduck

haven't you made it abundantly clear that you can do anything you put your mind to? why, then, would they have to lower the standards???

You have to have 20/20 vision uncorrected, plus answer a few questions that may have disqualified me. Becoming an astronaut is even harder than becoming an umpire.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

1. I said that if I had gone to umpire school and gotten a pro job, then I would have eventually made the big leagues.

2.This would have taken a lot of hard work as well as a great deal of breaks along the way, but it could have been done.

Sentence 2 is closer to reality. But still, coulda, woulda, shoulda...it's all an exercise in nonsense.

[/quote]I worked my a$$ off honing my skills in a much more strenuous environment than umpire school, which would have been like Club Med compared to the conditions I put myself through. I worked in excess of 200 games a year in most years, 6 and 7 days a week, including many solo 90' triple-headers on the weekends. And all that time I was receiving instructions from some very knowledgable pro school grads and minor league umpires. [quote]

You an a hundred other umpires that aren't good enough to get to the majors.

I know that I would have been a success in umpire school, and all that counts is that I know it, not anyone else.

When you're in a hole, you a need a ladder, not a shovel.

I could have been an astronaut too if they only lowered the standards for entry in that program.

OMG.

Keep digging.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by GarthB

When you're in a hole, you a need a ladder, not a shovel.

What The do you mean by that? I'm not digging a damn hole, nor am I in one.

Originally Posted by GarthB

OMG. Keep digging.

Did you not understand the astronaut analogy. I was saying what you keep saying, that everybody "coulda" been. You friggin missed the point entirely. I did not think that I needed to endure the kid piling on me as well. Again, I did not bring up the damn subject. I also said it was the last friggin time I wanted to hear any more about it. I want the last damn word on it, not the farkin peanut gallery.

AAUA96, I learned from actual minor league umpires, who were full-time minor league umpires. Our association has had quite a history of both minor and major league umpires among its ranks.

UES, what the f*ck are you talking about, little credibility? I have plenty of credibility here. I have contributed many good posts which have benefited umpires here and on other forums. If you dont' like what I post, then blow it out your a$$, ok punk?? I don't know who you think you are, but you need to shut the f*ck up. Who the f*ck are you?

Now, I don't want to discuss this sh*t any further, as I said.

Thanks for bringing up the subject, Garth. What did you expect me to say about it? That I've changed my mind and I'm just a real weak wanna-be official. NOT GONNA HAPPEN. I know what I know, and if you people want to say differently, then fine. None of you know me at all, so you all really need to keep your rude comments to yourselves.

[AAUA96]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

AAUA96, I learned from actual minor league umpires, who were full-time minor league umpires. Our association has had quite a history of both minor and major league umpires among its ranks.

SDS, you made my point. Fill-in's are not "actual minor league umpires" and should not mislead others into thinking that they are.

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

It is only minor league baseball for chrissakes. It is really not that big of a deal.

If you wonder why you draw such contentious disagreement, you only have to look at what you write. Those MiLB umpires that taught you so well, when they gave you an example from their experience, did you tell them "It is only MiLB, it's not that big of a deal?" Did you say "I know you did 500 professional games, but Mike had a fill-in game 4 years ago, and he says the proper mechanic is this, not what you just said. I'll do it his way?"

When it is in your best interest (when it applies to you), you hold MiLB umpires in high esteem. When you want to disagree with Garth, you choose to denigrate their profession and say "it's not that big of a deal" and it's okay to mislead others and pretend to have more qualifications than they really do.

Which is it - do MiLB umpires have your respect - or not?

Walt

[canadaump6]

I did not think that I needed to endure the kid piling on me as well.

Seeing as I will be 20 soon and consider myself mature beyond my years, I wouldn't exactly call myself a kid. What does it matter how old I am anyways. I was making the point that it doesn't matter what you can do, it matters what you actually do.

This brings us back to the whole ageism thing. So what if I'm 19? An opinion is an opinion and I think mine was reasonable enough, regardless of age. You're acting almost like an assignor who says "he's young, therefore he can't do that level of ball". In truth, age has little bearing on maturity or ability.

I should also add that I do not want to be associated with the people on here that like to pile on and give others a hard time. I'm not like that.