The Lofton Out at Second

[bobbybanaduck]

Originally Posted by David B

I don't want to be in the show, but I do know proper positioning for this play, and I'm sure his supervisor has made certain that he knows it.

MLB pays too much money for an obvious mistake, and they are professionals paid lots of money for what they do.

I don't have a problem with the call as I stated earlier, but I was just making a point to many of our younger officials,

"the umpire was not in the best position to make the call"

Thanks
David

what do you know of their supervisors???? do you not read other posts on here? remove shoe, stick foot in mouth, proceed.

[gordon30307]

Originally Posted by bobbybanaduck

what do you know of their supervisors???? do you not read other posts on here? remove shoe, stick foot in mouth, proceed.

Amen

[Rich]

Originally Posted by David B

I don't want to be in the show, but I do know proper positioning for this play, and I'm sure his supervisor has made certain that he knows it.

MLB pays too much money for an obvious mistake, and they are professionals paid lots of money for what they do.

I don't have a problem with the call as I stated earlier, but I was just making a point to many of our younger officials,

"the umpire was not in the best position to make the call"

Thanks
David

Proper is what their supervisors say. Period. Not what you or I or any other amateur official thinks.

[David B]

Originally Posted by gordon30307

All you younger officials out there pay no mind to this guy. He is wrong in this case.

Obviously you don't agree with the positioning and I would assume then that you didn't see the play either.

Enough said

Thanks
David

[gordon30307]

Originally Posted by David B

Obviously you don't agree with the positioning and I would assume then that you didn't see the play either.

Enough said

Thanks
David

I did see it and you are wrong. He was in perfect position to see the wacker at second. If I can be 3 to 5 feet away with the right angle why would I want the exact same angle at 10 to 12 feet away? I fail to see your point. Perception is reality. Who is more beleivable assuming the exact same angle and exact same call. The Umpire from 3 to 5 feet away or the one from 10 to 12 feet away. Assuming a four man crew make your calls from 10 to 12 feet away and I gurantee you'll set a new record for ejections.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by David B

"the umpire was not in the best position to make the call"

Thanks
David

You can't always get to the best possible postion. You need to get to the best position possible.

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by cmckenna

But if you watched the replay when they showed it again in one of the later innings, you could clearly see that yes Lofton's hand did touch the base but then he clearly came up off the bag and there was a time, while the tag was in contact where no part of Lofton was touching the bag.

Good call.

It's obvious you would have missed the call in real time and in instant replay. The tag had most definitely come off of Lofton by the time he had come of the base. I had originally thought from the original camera angle this was reason for the out call, if Lofton was out at all. My contention is that poor positioning or lack of hustle by U2 is the major reasoning the call was incorrect.

I do not attend nor watch baseball games to witness the umpires in action. However, I cannot recall a U2 taking a throw from left field and making a call from that position. From the cut of the grass inside the infield, yes. From behind second with the runner between him, no.

BTW-No argument by Wedge or Lofton doesn't mean they don't think a close call wasn't missed. That's just part of the game. Poor positioning by a MLB umpire shouldn't be.

[gordon30307]

Originally Posted by Steven Tyler

It's obvious you would have missed the call in real time and in instant replay. The tag had most definitely come off of Lofton by the time he had come of the base. I had originally thought from the original camera angle this was reason for the out call, if Lofton was out at all. My contention is that poor positioning or lack of hustle by U2 is the major reasoning the call was incorrect.

I do not attend nor watch baseball games to witness the umpires in action. However, I cannot recall a U2 taking a throw from left field and making a call from that position. From the cut of the grass inside the infield, yes. From behind second with the runner between him, no.

BTW-No argument by Wedge or Lofton doesn't mean they don't think a close call wasn't missed. That's just part of the game. Poor positioning by a MLB umpire shouldn't be.

Lofton lead off the inning. Position of the second base umpire is in center field. Remember the ball came off the Green Monster to the outfielder who threw to second. It would be next to impossible for him to get in the infield to make that call.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by gordon30307

It would be next to impossible for him to get in the infield to make that call.

However, if they were using Lance Cokalinski's 12 man mechanics, it would have been a piece of cake.

Another great reason to attend UmpireLance's Common Sense Umpiring and Screen Door Repair Clinic next March. The cost is affordable, the instruction unique and beer is free.

I highly recommend it. Get your reservation in before all the trailers are filled.

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by gordon30307

Lofton lead off the inning. Position of the second base umpire is in center field. Remember the ball came off the Green Monster to the outfielder who threw to second. It would be next to impossible for him to get in the infield to make that call.

Yes, I'm aware that Lofton was the lead off hitter and that the ball came off the Green Monster. Why would it be next to impossible? They've been getting inside for years at every ballpark in America, including Fenway. If Lofton has to run between 180' to 200', this slug should have been able to make at the maximum, 50'.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by GarthB

However, if they were using Lance Cokalinski's 12 man mechanics, it would have been a piece of cake.

Garth, I seem to remember Lance's mechanics applying to a 13-man crew: one umpire on each base, plus one on each member of the defense.

But I have no quarrel with the main point of your post.

[hawk21]

I do agree with you guys, IR for non infield calls. Let's keep the element of judgement in this game, if not then we are not really needed out there!

[gordon30307]

Originally Posted by Steven Tyler

Yes, I'm aware that Lofton was the lead off hitter and that the ball came off the Green Monster. Why would it be next to impossible? They've been getting inside for years at every ballpark in America, including Fenway. If Lofton has to run between 180' to 200', this slug should have been able to make at the maximum, 50'.

Just curious. What level of ball do you work? I'm guessing little fields.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by David B

I don't want to be in the show, but I do know proper positioning for this play, and I'm sure his supervisor has made certain that he knows it.

MLB pays too much money for an obvious mistake, and they are professionals paid lots of money for what they do.

I don't have a problem with the call as I stated earlier, but I was just making a point to many of our younger officials,

"the umpire was not in the best position to make the call"

Thanks
David

Despite your insistance, 12 to 15 feet away is a very good distance away from a force play. You should be much closer to the play for a tag. We've bantied this one about ad nauseum, but that's the way Jon Bible taught it, as well as the pro school guys I learned from. How the hell can you see a really slick tag of the runner on a banger from 15 feet away? What, you wearin' binoculars? I rarely missed a banger tag play over the years (other than the occasional pickoff where I was, listen closely, TOO FAR from the play). I feel that it was my positioning in a little closer proximity to the play that gave me a far superior look at exactly what transpired.

Currently evacuated to in-laws due to fires. Hope I don't lose home. Prayers appreciated.

[lawump]

Originally Posted by Steven Tyler

I do not attend nor watch baseball games to witness the umpires in action. However, I cannot recall a U2 taking a throw from left field and making a call from that position. From the cut of the grass inside the infield, yes. From behind second with the runner between him, no.

You must not have had MLB Extra Innings like I did this past season.