Stepping on plate an out ?? (LL)

[peterN]

Was at a Little League game the other day, and the Plate Umpire called a kid out for stepping on home plate after bunting the ball. The kid did stay in the box until the ball was hit, but stepped on the plate on his way to first.

I'm a dad, not an official, and tried to track this down in the Little League rule book a few years ago, and after the play the other night, I revisited the rule book (again) to no avail in my search for this as a reason to pit the runner out.
Is this an out for some reason that I am missing?

Thanx in advance for answers - peterN

[mbyron]

The only way the umpire could be right here would be if the batter ran into the batted ball. In baseball, stepping on the plate after a batted ball is nothing - I know little about LL, but I can't imagine it's any different on this point.

In umpiring as in everything else, you get what you pay for.

[sargee7]

"In umpiring as in everything else, you get what you pay for."

Please explain.

[PeteBooth]

peterN]Was at a Little League game the other day, and the Plate Umpire called a kid out for stepping on home plate after bunting the ball.

This is your version.

Perhaps the umpire called the kid out because he contacted the ball while being out of the batter's box not for stepping on the plate after the ball was already hit or in this case bunted.

Pete Booth

[tibear]

As Pete says, I would assume that the umpire called the batter out for having his entire foot on home plate when the ball was bunted and not for touching home plate after the ball had been hit.

[RPatrino]

Originally Posted by sargee7

"In umpiring as in everything else, you get what you pay for."

Please explain.

Sarge, the inference is that because most LL umpires are volunteer they are not as qualified as those who get paid for their work. I don't know if I could agree with this, as many LL umpires work for pay in other venues. So, they are bad in LL and good everywhere else?

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by tibear

As Pete says, I would assume that the umpire called the batter out for having his entire foot on home plate when the ball was bunted and not for touching home plate after the ball had been hit.

Assuming OBR rules, if any of the batter's foot is still touching the line of the batter's box the umpire shouldn't have ruled the batter out. Only in FED is touching the plate during contact an out.

If the batted ball contacted the batter, the batter must be completely out of the box for the out to be called.

[aceholleran]

LL rules exactly the same as OBR in this. About the call? HTBT.

Nearing my swan song as an ump, I do only LL games now (some on normal diamond). In general, many LL umps I have seen are at the bottom end of the umpiring chain.

In addition to the volunteer basis, there are other reasons, IMHO.

• Many arbiters are older and have been making the same mistakes for years--they are so senior that no one can tell them that white socks, for example, don't make it.
  
• In general, LL umps are not members of any "association." Ergo, no one to evaluate them, teach proper mechanics, etc. W-port frowns on umpires' associations.
  
• Younger umps coming up the ladder learn from these Smitties and develop the same bad habits.
  
• Other leagues (Babe Ruth, e. g.) get their umps from the local high school board where training and evaluation are much better effected.

Myself and some other umps have gotten around these problems and have established a nice cadre of about 30 local LL umps, all with Fed patches. Email me personally and I'll tell you how.

Ace Holleran

[email protected]

[bob jenkins]

[QUOTE=Steven Tyler]Assuming OBR rules, if any of the batter's foot is still touching the line of the batter's box the umpire shouldn't have ruled the batter out. Only in FED is touching the plate during contact an out.
/QUOTE]

The NCAA rule is the same as the FED rule.

[DesertBlue]

Ace is correct in his views. I started out in LL and right now i am paid almost year round to umpire games. When LL All-Stars rolls I volunteer some of my time returning to LL for what they try to do for boys and girls despite the parents.
This may also be the last year I volunteer as the quality of the higher ups in LL umpires really sucks.
They wear their patches proudly yet do not have a clue as to what they are doing. In a state game last night one member of the crew I am part of went into the visitors dugout during a rain delay and removed a dozen bats. I asked him why, as the equipment was already checked by my partner, HS official, and he said they were the wrong size. He pulled all but the 2 5/8 bats. I quickly let him know every bat he pulled was legal according to LL rules.

[sargee7]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

Sarge, the inference is that because most LL umpires are volunteer they are not as qualified as those who get paid for their work. I don't know if I could agree with this, as many LL umpires work for pay in other venues. So, they are bad in LL and good everywhere else?

RPatrino. Thanks for the response. that's how I was reading the inference as well.

I resent the implication that volunteer blues are not as good as paid. I have been doing this a long time in both venues.

You are also correct that there are good and bad in both paid and unpaid venues.

Thanks, Bill P

[UmpLarryJohnson]

RESENT all you want hope that works out for YOU

[Delaware Blue]

Originally Posted by DesertBlue

I asked him why, as the equipment was already checked by my partner, HS official, and he said they were the wrong size. He pulled all but the 2 5/8 bats. I quickly let him know every bat he pulled was legal according to LL rules.

Just out of curiosity, what LL Division game was that?

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by DesertBlue

They wear their patches proudly yet do not have a clue as to what they are doing. In a state game last night one member of the crew I am part of went into the visitors dugout during a rain delay and removed a dozen bats. I asked him why, as the equipment was already checked by my partner, HS official, and he said they were the wrong size. He pulled all but the 2 5/8 bats. I quickly let him know every bat he pulled was legal according to LL rules.

Your partner was a prime example of an OOO

[lawump]

Steve,

Your 3 O's:
OOO

are good, but not as good as 2 O's properly placed:

(o)(o)