Who Entitled to the base?

tibear · #1 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 10:46am

I'm having a debate on another website with regards to the following situation: R1 & R2. Batter hits ground ball to F6. F6 waits to tag R2 but R2 returns to second base which now has R1 standing on it. So both R1 & R2 are standing on 2nd base. Upon tagging both runners, which is out?

Others have quoted 7.03 saying that the preceeding runner always has priority but in this situation I'm quoting 7.01 which indicates that R2 loses his right to second base because of the force situation.

Which is right?

UmpJM · #2 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 10:50am

tibear,

In this case, the preceding runner is out when tagged - because, as you suggest, he has been "forced" to relinquish the base by virtue of the batter becoming a runner, per 7.01. Also, see 7.08(e) and the Rule 2.0 definition of "Force Play".

JM

ozzy6900 · #3 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 11:06am

Quote:

Originally Posted by tibear

I'm having a debate on another website with regards to the following situation: R1 & R2. Batter hits ground ball to F6. F6 waits to tag R2 but R2 returns to second base which now has R1 standing on it. So both R1 & R2 are standing on 2nd base. Upon tagging both runners, which is out?

Others have quoted 7.03 saying that the preceeding runner always has priority but in this situation I'm quoting 7.01 which indicates that R2 loses his right to second base because of the force situation.

Which is right?

Go tell those bone heads to read the rules again!

Explain to them that when you have R1 & R2, any hit becomes a Force Play!

Because of the Force Play, has to go to 3rd - there is no option to return to 2nd base in this situation! F6 can tag as many people as he wants, R2 is out and R1 remains at 2nd in this situation. R1 lost the right to 2nd base the moment that the batter registered a hit and that is all there is to that.

I also suggest that you cease operations at that no-nothing site - unless you want to become like these morons!

tibear · #4 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 11:10am

Most of the people on the other site don't actually know the rules and I'm trying my best to educate them.

When questions are asked, I give answers with rule references and try to explain but sometimes they get hard headed and refuse to believe me. That is when I turn to this website because I know I'll get the right answer and hopefully additional rule references to back it up.

Thanks

David B · #5 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 11:32am

Quote:

Originally Posted by tibear

Most of the people on the other site don't actually know the rules and I'm trying my best to educate them.

When questions are asked, I give answers with rule references and try to explain but sometimes they get hard headed and refuse to believe me. That is when I turn to this website because I know I'll get the right answer and hopefully additional rule references to back it up.

Thanks

Umpires who won't belive the rule book - WOW!!

Now I just can NOT believe that would ever happen .... (big grin)

Stay away from the Smittys, you can't educate them!!!

Thanks
DAvid

justanotherblue · #6 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 11:56am

I sure hope they're wearing their helmets on that short bus

What part of Force play do they not understand???? Oh wait.. obviously ALL OF IT

mcrowder · #7 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 04:29pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by David B

Umpires who won't belive the rule book - WOW!!

Now I just can NOT believe that would ever happen .... (big grin)

Stay away from the Smittys, you can't educate them!!!

Thanks
DAvid

He didn't say he's dealing with UMPIRES on that other site. In fact, I kind of assumed it was predominantly fans/coaches/parents, and not umpires - and that he was the token umpire trying his best to educate the uneducated. If I'm wrong, Tiger, please correct me.

GarthB · #8 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 05:26pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by boyinblue24

After being tagged the force is removed until the next ball is put in play.

WTF?

ozzy6900 · #9 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 06:37pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by boyinblue24

BINGO! since it was a force play for R1, it was a force play for R2 as well. R2 returned to second (where R1 is), therefore R2 is out. After being tagged the force is removed until the next ball is put in play.

Damn! you had it correct until you added that crazy line "After being tagged the force is removed until the next ball is put in play." Where the he]] did you get that from?

ozzy6900 · #10 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 06:39pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by boyinblue24

BINGO! since it was a force play for R1, it was a force play for R2 as well. R2 returned to second (where R1 is), therefore R2 is out. After being tagged the force is removed until the next ball is put in play.

Damn! you had everything right until you added that BS line ---- "After being tagged the force is removed until the next ball is put in play."

ozzy6900 · #11 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 06:41pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by boyinblue24

BINGO! since it was a force play for R1, it was a force play for R2 as well. R2 returned to second (where R1 is), therefore R2 is out. After being tagged the force is removed until the next ball is put in play.

Now you had everthing correct and then you aded that BS line "After being tagged the force is removed until the next ball is put in play.
Damn! you had everything right until you added that BS line ---- "After being tagged the force is removed until the next ball is put in play." Where did you get that mess from?

greymule · #12 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 07:38pm

Some people are misled by the term "preceding runner," thinking it means "the runner who was on the bag first," rather than "the runner closer to home plate on the base paths." Therefore, they think that if R2 is standing on 3B and then R3 returns to 3B, R2—because he was on the bag first—is the preceding runner and has the right to the bag.

mrm21711 · #13 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 09:14pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by boyinblue24

BINGO! since it was a force play for R1, it was a force play for R2 as well. R2 returned to second (where R1 is), therefore R2 is out.

Theres no reason to re-answer the question when it has been beaten to death already by everybody else.

And yes....WTF?

LMan · #14 (**permalink**) Tue Mar 13, 2007, 11:03pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by GarthB

WTF?

LOL!

.......

UmpJM · #15 (**permalink**) Wed Mar 14, 2007, 12:41am

Quote:

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

Go tell those bone heads to read the rules again!

Explain to them that when you have R1 & R2, any hit becomes a Force Play!

Because of the Force Play, has to go to 3rd - there is no option to return to 2nd base in this situation! F6 can tag as many people as he wants, R2 is out and R1 remains at 2nd in this situation. R1 lost the right to 2nd base the moment that the batter registered a hit and that is all there is to that.

I also suggest that you cease operations at that no-nothing site - unless you want to become like these morons!

Ozzy,

No need to sugarcoat it like that. Just tell 'em how it is. And how it makes you feel. (jes teasin')

JM

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