Fall Ball Sportsmanship

[PeteBooth]

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

I don't care if it is Fall-ball, Summer-ball, or Spring-ball. Changing the strike zone as ctblu40 and LMAN suggest is Fool's-ball.

There is nothing that you can say to convince me, gentlemen. You two (and anyone else that does this) should hang up your uniforms and never darken the baseball diamond again.

An umpire is supposed to be unbiased. At least that's the way it's supposed to be. So by the same token, if it's a tie game do you guys shrink the strike zone to help the batters? Come on, you guys are BS! Please don't embarrass yourselves by responding any further. Take your sorry a$$es and burn your uniforms. You make the rest of us sick!

Ozzy, IMO you are missing the point on this one.

The first question?

Why are we there in the first place?

Answer: To make certain that one team does not gain an UNFAIR advantage not intended by the rules over another.

When the score is rediculous, how does changing the zone give one team an unfair advantage over another. Most kids in a blow-out game have already batted a "zillion" times. When I played and we were getting blown out I wanted no part of the game. It was time to go back to practice and get ready for the next game.

No-one, The coaches, parents etc. want to be there when the score is lopsided, especially on those cold days. Also, nothing good comes out of it.

As I stated in my original response, IMO the onus should be on the coaches to stop the game (absent any kind of mercy rule).

IMO, we are not "cheating" when we change the zone because the score is out of hand. Also, the game is for the participants not US so if our CLIENTS want us to change the zone and get the game over with, then we abide. They are the ones "paying the freight"

Also, we are talking about a BLOWOUT game not a game in which one team is up by say 7-8 runs in the early innings where the other team has a chance to come-back. By Blow-out we are talking about a team who is winning by some 15 runs and if they kept playing hard could easily be up by 30 or more.

Pete Booth

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by PeteBooth

Ozzy, IMO you are missing the point on this one.

The first question?

Why are we there in the first place?

Answer: To make certain that one team does not gain an UNFAIR advantage not intended by the rules over another.

When the score is rediculous, how does changing the zone give one team an unfair advantage over another. Most kids in a blow-out game have already batted a "zillion" times. When I played and we were getting blown out I wanted no part of the game. It was time to go back to practice and get ready for the next game.

No-one, The coaches, parents etc. want to be there when the score is lopsided, especially on those cold days. Also, nothing good comes out of it.

As I stated in my original response, IMO the onus should be on the coaches to stop the game (absent any kind of mercy rule).

IMO, we are not "cheating" when we change the zone because the score is out of hand. Also, the game is for the participants not US so if our CLIENTS want us to change the zone and get the game over with, then we abide. They are the ones "paying the freight"

Also, we are talking about a BLOWOUT game not a game in which one team is up by say 7-8 runs in the early innings where the other team has a chance to come-back. By Blow-out we are talking about a team who is winning by some 15 runs and if they kept playing hard could easily be up by 30 or more.

Pete Booth

So then Pete, why don't we just let the batter of the good team come to the plate and simply call him out on strikes right then and there? That is what you are doing by "opening up your zone" for that team anyway.

In your own words, "As I stated in my original response, IMO the onus should be on the coaches to stop the game (absent any kind of mercy rule)." Let the coaches deal with it!

So in my words, anyone and I mean ANYONE that does this is horse$hit!

Finis

[SanDiegoSteve]

Ozzy, they do it all the time in spring training games in MLB. They call runners out when they are 2 steps past the base, they expand the strike zone, the don't call balks, etc. They try to speed the games up, especially in the Cactus League, where it's hotter than blazes all the time, and the games are lopsided.

The players and coaches all understand this, and they appreciate the service. These games are scheduled for 9 innings, and there is no mercy rule available. They can't just agree to stop the game, they have to play it out. The only ones who can mercifully speed them up is the umpires.

[LMan]

How come you keep saying you are 'done with this' yet you keep responding with the same argument?

You are of course entitled to your POV but shouting it over and over doesn't change anything on either side.

Your overbearing legalism on this rather small area of game management is puzzling to me, to say the least. I work with umpires who feel as you do, but they don't threaten excommunication because of it.

Sure, there are some risks inherent in the strategy. There's risk in every game-management decision we make. That's for each umpire to assess and act accordingly, which is why 'not everyone can umpire.'

[mcrowder]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Ozzy, they do it all the time in spring training games in MLB. They call runners out when they are 2 steps past the base, they expand the strike zone, the don't call balks, etc. They try to speed the games up, especially in the Cactus League, where it's hotter than blazes all the time, and the games are lopsided.

The players and coaches all understand this, and they appreciate the service. These games are scheduled for 9 innings, and there is no mercy rule available. They can't just agree to stop the game, they have to play it out. The only ones who can mercifully speed them up is the umpires.

Holy crap. What complete nonsense. Every single sentence. Complete and utter nonsense.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by mcrowder

Holy crap. What complete nonsense. Every single sentence. Complete and utter nonsense.

I've attended many a spring training game in Yuma when the Padres used to train there, and I'm not the only one who has noticed that what I said actually occurs. I've also heard the broadcasters say the same thing in these games. So, you are saying that you have umpired in spring training games and know better? Didn't know you were a pro, my bad.

[Dave Hensley]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

I've attended many a spring training game in Yuma when the Padres used to train there, and I'm not the only one who has noticed that what I said actually occurs. I've also heard the broadcasters say the same thing in these games. So, you are saying that you have umpired in spring training games and know better? Didn't know you were a pro, my bad.

I do an annual spring training vacation, and the last two years have gone to Arizona for (mostly) Rangers games.

It's been my observation for those two years that the weather was damn nice, the games were all reasonably competitive, and the umpires appeared, to me at least, to be doing what they should be doing, i.e., working their own spring training and tuning up for the real deal. I've noticed umpires experimenting with different stances and different mechanics, but I have not observed what I would consider any "mercy" calls to try to Kevork an out-of-hand game.

But I promise I won't get as emotional about our differing viewpoints as ozzy6900 got.

[DG]

Coach of a 13-14 team winning big should not need to ask for a larger zone in a fall ball game for 2 reasons:

1. He can tell his players to be aggressive at the plate and swing at at anything close and if they connect, well sh*t happens.

2. The zone should already be BIG, for both teams equally.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by PWL

If the umpires where this bad, no wonder you thought you could have been a ML umpire.....

Good one. I actually am smiling!

[mcrowder]

Originally Posted by PWL

Oh, you could not be more wrong. They play until they run out of pitching on both sides. It is not that hot in Arizona in March. Yes they speed the games up, but that is because it is not like the regular season when you have all the commercials and the wins mean something. I guarantee you an umpire who calls a runner out two steps past the base will not be an umpire long. They just don't come out and argue every call. They just sit in the dugout and worry about the upcoming season. I know, I've been there.

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