Tie goes to runner?

[jwwashburn]

Originally Posted by steve friendly

I need to know when the ball and the runner touch the base at the same time, what is the call? Thank you

SMACK=sound of the ball in the glove.
THUMP=sound of the Batter/runner hitting the base

Smack Thump=OUT
Thump Smack=SAFE
THACK or SMUMP=OUT

The tie goes to the umpire.

Joe

[steve friendly]

Thanks for that info guys, but what is the rule? Is he safe or out on an actual tie?

[shickenbottom]

I had a coach come to me once and ask about that whacker that occurred on 1st base. I explained it was close, pop..thud. He asked the same question just asked, "what happens when there is a tie between the ball and the runner."

I came back with a quick retort on the spur of the moment, it got a good laugh from him and myself. It goes like this: "Contrary to popular myths and beliefs, a tie does not belong to the runner, it belongs to the umpire, and umpires like two things, Strikes and Outs."

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by steve friendly

Thanks for that info guys, but what is the rule? Is he safe or out on an actual tie?

Read all of rule 7.00 (the runner) in the official rules of baseball. I will mail you $1,000 for each time you find the word, "tie".

[SanDiegoSteve]

SOFE, no wait, AUT, uh......DO OVER!

[steve friendly]

I read all of rule 7.0. Your money is safe, but is the runner? How do I contact M.L.B Umpires Association on this one? No one seems to have a cut and dried answer. Not just here on this board, but elswhere. Maybe the umpires association can settle this one. Or maybe I'm just dreaming.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by steve friendly

I read all of rule 7.0. Your money is safe, but is the runner? How do I contact M.L.B Umpires Association on this one? No one seems to have a cut and dried answer. Not just here on this board, but elswhere. Maybe the umpires association can settle this one. Or maybe I'm just dreaming.

7.08 (e) out.

6.05 (j) safe.

You decide which is correct.

[SanDiegoSteve]

mr. friendly.....check out this thread:

Never reward a bad Defensive Play !

[shickenbottom]

Did the runner beat the ball to the bag? Meaning, did the runner attain the base (touch it) prior to the ball arriving? If so, then he is safe, if not, he's out.

You may percieve a grey area where it is difficult to decide, ask yourself, did the defense make the play difficult for you to decide or was it an incredible defensive play. Here are a couple of instances where you can use the fielding to determine the call:

"Easy grounder to infielder, who muffs the ball, picks it up and throws, it's difficult to determine the outcome after the throw, since the defense muffed the play, on this whacker. Safe."

"Difficult grounder that middle infielder makes an incredible stab at, fields it an throws to the bag. Again, it's difficult to determine whether the runner is safe or out. Give the benefit to the defense for making the play. Out."

Otherwise if it's a normal play, nothing out of the ordinary, and it's close, listen to what you hear. Pop..Thud = Out; Thud..Pop = Safe.

[jwwashburn]

Originally Posted by shickenbottom

Did the runner beat the ball to the bag? Meaning, did the runner attain the base (touch it) prior to the ball arriving? If so, then he is safe, if not, he's out.

You may percieve a grey area where it is difficult to decide, ask yourself, did the defense make the play difficult for you to decide or was it an incredible defensive play. Here are a couple of instances where you can use the fielding to determine the call:

"Easy grounder to infielder, who muffs the ball, picks it up and throws, it's difficult to determine the outcome after the throw, since the defense muffed the play, on this whacker. Safe."

"Difficult grounder that middle infielder makes an incredible stab at, fields it an throws to the bag. Again, it's difficult to determine whether the runner is safe or out. Give the benefit to the defense for making the play. Out."

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[Dave Hensley]

Originally Posted by steve friendly

I read all of rule 7.0. Your money is safe, but is the runner? How do I contact M.L.B Umpires Association on this one? No one seems to have a cut and dried answer. Not just here on this board, but elswhere. Maybe the umpires association can settle this one. Or maybe I'm just dreaming.

A strict and literal reading of the rules won't help much, because it would tell you that a "tie" goes to the runner at 1B, but goes to the fielder on force plays at any other base. The truth is the rulesmakers didn't word the rules with any kind of distinction like that in mind; they simply did not consider, or deliberately provide for, the concept of a "tie" in the rules.

The answers you're getting here are as good as you're gonna get, i.e., they're the same answers you'll get from one or more MLB umpires.

[Uncle George]

There is no such thing as a tie in baseball. The Batter-runner is either out or safe! Plus, it's a judgement call and we all know that judgement calls can't be argued! Right!

[Tim C]

I have refrained so far -- but I cannot help myself . . .

++++++++++++++++

It doesn't matter if the two actions happen exactly at the same time.

"Why" you may ask?, simple:

The NBA and NTSB both did independent studies that show the exact same outcome:

The human mind cannot tell what happens as soon as two actions occurr within .04 of a second of each other.

Both studies showed that no matter what happens the human brain cannot define the order of happenings when they happen so close together.

I would contend that an umpire simply will make the call based on what "appeared" to have happened.

While there are no "ties" (when dealing with safe/out), we wouldn't know it if it happened.

Regards,

[johnnyg08]

There's nothing more you're going to hear from MLB about this one...in fact I'd be surprised if they'd even take the time to answer a question like that. There are no ties...only for the Saab driving mom in the stands.

[LLPA13UmpDan]

Some think its a rule that tie goes to the runner; and some umpires call a game that way too. But in reality, thats wrong. Rule says the batter MUST BEAT the ball to the bag; meaning a tie would be an out. Simple. and i have never seen it happen where the ball gets there at EXACTLY the same time the ball gets there.