when in doubt call...foul?

[ToGreySt]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Uhhh, yeah that's nice, but we were talking about fair/foul calls where there are no lines drawn. Who was talking about close pitches or bangers?

would you all agree that a close pitch that makes you think twice should NOT be called a strike then?

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by ToGreySt

would you all agree that a close pitch that makes you think twice should NOT be called a strike then?

All pitches make me think twice. It's called timing.

[LMan]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

All pitches make me think twice. It's called timing.

ha HA! *zing*

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

All pitches make me think twice. It's called timing.

No. Timing is defined as "the proper use of the eyes." With good timing, "hesitation", or "thinking twice" is not necessary.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Well, I've always reviewed what I've seen in my mind before calling it. I've never heard of "the proper use of the eyes" named as the definition of timing, so I'll have to take your word for it.

I think whatever works for each umpire is fine. Reviewing a pitch, or a close play in one's mind (calling it to yourself first) is not to be confused with being "hesitant" or "unsure" about a call. It mostly confirms the call that was seen with the proper use of the eyes.

Frank Pulli had the fastest strike call I've ever seen, and horrible timing. He also missed a lot of pitches. Coincedence? I don't think so. Was this due to improper use of his eyes?

[LMan]

Originally Posted by GarthB

Did anybody hear something?

If a poster on the ignore-list types, did he make a sound?

[BigUmp56]

Originally Posted by GarthB

No. Timing is defined as "the proper use of the eyes." With good timing, "hesitation", or "thinking twice" is not necessary.

I respectfully disagree, Garth. Good timing is seeing the ball all the way to the mitt, making a slight hesitation, and then making the call. If you don't make that slight hesitation you'll miss some of those nasty breaking pitches and most likely a foul tip or two.


Tim.

[TussAgee11]

I totally agree with the Summer Ball Mechanic of PU taking the fair foul on the ones down the line with BU in A. The rat coaches will not know that this is not the accepted mechanic. But it will give the best result most of the time. Also, even if the coach does know its supposed to be BU's call, then he's pretty smart, and should also understand that without lines it is eaisier for PU.

Over the bag is still BU.

[Tim C]

. . . youse guiys read my Evans Column in Strikes & Outs --

"Timing in the proper use of eyes" is the Evans credo that is hammered and hammered.

It makes no difference if it is a simple safe/out call or a nutcutter of ball/strike -- the timing is established by the "proper use of eyes."

It is a great credo that is used in all umpire schools and clinics as taught by professional school instructors.

There should not be a hesitation -- timing happens as a natural process if you have proper use of eyes.

Regards,

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by BigUmp56

I respectfully disagree, Garth. Good timing is seeing the ball all the way to the mitt, making a slight hesitation, and then making the call. If you don't make that slight hesitation you'll miss some of those nasty breaking pitches and most likely a foul tip or two.


Tim.

Hestitation is phony timing. It accomplishes nothing. It's no different than the Smittys who tell you, "Count one-one thousand, two, before calling a pitch." Garbage.

If you utilize proper use of the eyes you won't miss any "nasty" breaking pitches, foult tips or dropped third strikes for that matter. But first, you must learn proper use of the eyes.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by GarthB

Hestitation is phony timing. It accomplishes nothing. It's no different than the Smittys who tell you, "Count one-one thousand, two, before calling a pitch." Garbage.

If you utilize proper use of the eyes you won't miss any "nasty" breaking pitches, foult tips or dropped third strikes for that matter. But first, you must learn proper use of the eyes.

I ain't never learned nuthin' 'bout no baseball umpirin' from no Smittys, but I have been instructed not to call pitches too quickly, and was even evaluated down once for a perceived "too quick timing" on pitches. This was from a big shot muckity muck pro school guru type guy, who wanted everyone to be as slow and deliberate as Greg Bonin or like Jerry Layne used to be (Jerry has speeded it up a bit).

I agree that counting the seconds is ridiculous, but a delayed strike call has always been taught in the clinics and classrooms I have been a part of. It only shows that you are not rushing your call, not that you are "hesitant." Of course now, I never attended any classes taught by Jim Evans, so I can't speak for what he teaches.

I don't miss any nasty breaking pitches, foul tips, or dropped third strikes either. I must have proper eye usage.

[mbyron]

Well, I had 2 nasty fair/foul calls lately. Both were in 18U tourney games.

1. R1, RH batter is a little late and loops a liner down the RF line. F3 is just inside the line, and the coach comes up to the line just in foul territory. They're looking down the line and block me out. Ball drops fast - too fast for me to read the problem and adjust to see where it lands.

2. R1, RH batter pulls one to deep left, right into the setting sun. I move down the line, watching F7 run toward the line to make the play. I try to pick up the ball, but can't. Next time I see the ball it's bouncing up.

I understand that these are both my fault: I need to get in position somehow to make the call in (1), and I need to pick up the ball in (2). I called both 'foul', but I like the idea of calling it fair when the batter "beats" the pitcher.

There was quite a bit of crying in (1), as I guess the ball landed on the line. In (2) only the 3B coach cried, which means either that the ball was foul or that nobody else could see it either!

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

I ain't never learned nuthin' 'bout no baseball umpirin' from no Smittys, but I have been instructed not to call pitches too quickly, and was even evaluated down once for a perceived "too quick timing" on pitches.

With good timing - proper use of the eyes - one will not call pitches too quickly, and one will not have to utilize any phony hesitation. The timing will be correct without it.

Also, with good timing - proper use of the eyes - one will not make callst to quickly on the bases and will never have to say, "Out..no...Safe". Again, this will ocurr without any phony hesitation. Propers use of the eyes will provide the correct timing.

This not just a "Jim Evans" thing. This is taught at both pro schools.

Instead of taking someone else word for proper mechanics, whether it is one of your local "mucky mucks" or anyone on the internet, go get trained first hand. The Evans Desert Classic is not far from you and will make you a better umpire in a week.