Disappointed in AMLU

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by NIump50

1. AMLU said and I paraphrase We won't work amateur games

So. If you were dump enough to think that was going to happen, shame on you for not using common sense.

Originally Posted by NIump50

2. But wait, they are working amateur games and taking the plums to boot.

Taken from whom? If you were good enough to boot, then you would not have anything taken from you. BTW, I am sure many amateur umpires were not working games, they were scabbing.

Originally Posted by NIump50

3. They lied

Lied to whom? They did not lie to me. I never heard a single Minor League umpire make that promise to me. The only place I have heard that claim was here. Also if that claim was made, I would not be dumb enough to expect them to hold to that if the strike went on for a long time. Many did not think it was going to go on this long. So I am sorry you believe everything that someone tells you.

Originally Posted by NIump50

4. No need to blame anyone but the union and it's members.

I believe in taking responsibility for what I do. I do not blame other people because I could not cut it or what I did not accomplish. What you need to do is look right in the mirror and wonder why you were passed over. I was not passed over. And if I was I think union members are not the ones I would be looking at.

Originally Posted by NIump50

If the union cannot control it's membership then they should not speak for the membership.
If the members won't listen to the union then why should the amatuer?

If you ever think the leadership of any organization can totally control the membership, then you must not be aware of how organizations are run.

Originally Posted by NIump50

To use your logic, no blame or ill will should be given to the replacement, blame the assignor, MiLB
Is that how you feel?

You have the right to feel whatever you like. I just think you sound like a cry baby when you things do not go your way. If it was not the union, it would be something else. The union members did not give out assignments. I also feel that the assignors are not to blame. The assignors were doing their job. If some guys got screwed, will not be the first time and it definitely will not be the last.

Peace

[NIump50]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

So. If you were dump enough to think that was going to happen, shame on you for not using common sense.



Taken from whom? If you were good enough to boot, then you would not have anything taken from you. BTW, I am sure many amateur umpires were not working games, they were scabbing.



Lied to whom? They did not lie to me. I never heard a single Minor League umpire make that promise to me. The only place I have heard that claim was here. Also if that claim was made, I would not be dumb enough to expect them to hold to that if the strike went on for a long time. Many did not think it was going to go on this long. So I am sorry you believe everything that someone tells you.



I believe in taking responsibility for what I do. I do not blame other people because I could not cut it or what I did not accomplish. What you need to do is look right in the mirror and wonder why you were passed over. I was not passed over. And if I was I think union members are not the ones I would be looking at.



If you ever think the leadership of any organization can totally control the membership, then you must not be aware of how organizations are run.



You have the right to feel whatever you like. I just think you sound like a cry baby when you things do not go your way. If it was not the union, it would be something else. The union members did not give out assignments. I also feel that the assignors are not to blame. The assignors were doing their job. If some guys got screwed, will not be the first time and it definitely will not be the last.

Peace

J
I could care less what games any ump does. It's only an issue because AMLU said we won't do amateur. Whether or not I believed them is not the issue. Let's eleminate for the moment the responsibility the union member has to the union.
The union made a promise they either knew they couldn't keep,or had expectations from their members to honor the promise or just outright lied.
Which was it? And why did they say it to begin with?
Answer these two questions honestly and everything else falls into place.

You can hide your head in the sand all you want, it doesn't change the facts.
AMLU in an attempt to strengthen their position and dissuade amateurs from doing MiLB said in essence, you stay off our turf, we'll stay off yours.

I agree witha lot of what you say about who gets the work and who doesn't, but it's not the issue. I could care less where AMLU guys work.
But J don't tell me that it's ok for the individual AMLU member to break ranks and do amateur games but the replacement is a scab and worthy of being blackballed in the community.
Live on one side of the fence or the other.
It seems you have more misplaced loyalty to the union than it's actual members. Why is that?

[WhatWuzThatBlue]

NI, you are trying to teach a pig to sing...it ain't happenin'.

Let it go; you'll never be able to explain to people like him what it means to be professional. When the AMLU site posted a notice stipulating that they would not work any amateur contests while on strike, that was merely a suggestion to their members (right!). If Jeff didn't receive an email asking him not to accept MiLB assignments, that speaks volumes about what others thought of him. I received a half dozen from mostly ML guys. They implored me not to cross their line and support my brothers in blue. I did not accept assignments, even when contacted by GMs and a local assignor. If Jeff did not recieve these calls it was likelly because they had never heard of him. The talent in the area is scouted and the best umpires are noticed. I'm sure that the same goes in your neck of the woods.

This strike went longer than any of them anticipated. The bank accounts are getting low and they need to bring home some bacon. I really couldn't care if they want to work some rec games or summer ball. Taking playoff assignments from the guys who earned them is worse than 'scabbing'. The replacements are accepting assignments that would go unfilled by the guys who earned the right to be there. The AMLU strikers have not worked forty game Springs (in the rain, snow and broiling heat). Now they want the plums and are only too happy to accept them. So much for being professional.

By the way - Pete in AZ don't be ashamed to work those games. Just do a great job and let the chips fall. Did you see if your photo is on the AMLU site? I wouldn't be surprised if someone snapped away and found one of you talking with a base coach - they'll label it "Scab getting red-assed for not hustling or blowing another balk call".

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by NIump50

I could care less what games any ump does. It's only an issue because AMLU said we won't do amateur. Whether or not I believed them is not the issue. Let's eleminate for the moment the responsibility the union member has to the union.

I "couldn't care less" what you think about the union or what they said and did not say.

Originally Posted by NIump50

The union made a promise they either knew they couldn't keep,or had expectations from their members to honor the promise or just outright lied.
Which was it? And why did they say it to begin with?

Who cares?

Originally Posted by NIump50

Answer these two questions honestly and everything else falls into place.


You can hide your head in the sand all you want, it doesn't change the facts.
AMLU in an attempt to strengthen their position and dissuade amateurs from doing MiLB said in essence, you stay off our turf, we'll stay off yours.

Once again, who cares? If you were good enough you would get the assignments. If the Minor League umpires are not working pro ball anymore, they will flood the "market" of amateur games and the same thing will happen. Whether it is HS, college or any summer league that comes around the assignors are going to assign the best people available. If they do not hire the best officials, then that is something they will have to live with. I also say this because every sport I work someone complains they did not get a post season assignment. Someone always complains they did not advance further. Someone always complains it was some underhanded reason they did not get a shot. This is the same story all the time just a bunch of different circumstances.

Originally Posted by NIump50

I agree witha lot of what you say about who gets the work and who doesn't, but it's not the issue. I could care less where AMLU guys work.
But J don't tell me that it's ok for the individual AMLU member to break ranks and do amateur games but the replacement is a scab and worthy of being blackballed in the community.

Who said anyone should be blackballed? It is clear you have never read any of my statements on this issue.

Originally Posted by NIump50

Live on one side of the fence or the other.
It seems you have more misplaced loyalty to the union than it's actual members. Why is that?

Loyalty? What the hell does loyalty have to do with this issue? What I think you have is misplaced stupidity when you believe a statement (which I have yet to see outside of hearsay BTW) that no umpire was going to work games at any level what so ever. Not only would that be stupid to believe so, it would not be realistic. So you are going to tell me a guy that normally uses the money they make umpiring to support their family or any living expense is going to not work any games because a bunch of guys do not want them to? You have got to be kidding? Now that is the funniest thing I have heard in a long time.

Peace

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by WhatWuzThatBlue

If Jeff didn't receive an email asking him not to accept MiLB assignments, that speaks volumes about what others thought of him. I received a half dozen from mostly ML guys. They implored me not to cross their line and support my brothers in blue. I did not accept assignments, even when contacted by GMs and a local assignor. If Jeff did not recieve these calls it was likelly because they had never heard of him. The talent in the area is scouted and the best umpires are noticed. I'm sure that the same goes in your neck of the woods.

Not only did I receive an email, I talked directly to the people that sent out the email. I had drinks with the very people that sent out personal emails about the situation. There are two Minor League Umpires that work Basketball and we have been talking about this issue long before it was ever talked about on this or any website. I also did not read in any email that said they would not work any games of any kind under any circumstances. I was one of many that were asked directly by one assignor, "What do you think about me giving games to Minor League umpires games at our level?" The response from me and others is "We do not care." When this assignor every day is trying to fill games in afternoon to cover a game around 4:00 because of changes, why would I care if he gave an assignment to a Minor League guy? I have worked games all season with Minor League guys from time to time. I would work college games that were rescheduled and my partner would be a Minor League guy. Not everyone is available the day before to work a noon start.

Woooowwwww, I did not get a call. Man, how is my life going to go on?

Peace

[NIump50]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I "couldn't care less" what you think about the union or what they said and did not say.



Who cares?




Once again, who cares? If you were good enough you would get the assignments. If the Minor League umpires are not working pro ball anymore, they will flood the "market" of amateur games and the same thing will happen. Whether it is HS, college or any summer league that comes around the assignors are going to assign the best people available. If they do not hire the best officials, then that is something they will have to live with. I also say this because every sport I work someone complains they did not get a post season assignment. Someone always complains they did not advance further. Someone always complains it was some underhanded reason they did not get a shot. This is the same story all the time just a bunch of different circumstances.



Who said anyone should be blackballed? It is clear you have never read any of my statements on this issue.



Loyalty? What the hell does loyalty have to do with this issue? What I think you have is misplaced stupidity when you believe a statement (which I have yet to see outside of hearsay BTW) that no umpire was going to work games at any level what so ever. Not only would that be stupid to believe so, it would not be realistic. So you are going to tell me a guy that normally uses the money they make umpiring to support their family or any living expense is going to not work any games because a bunch of guys do not want them to? You have got to be kidding? Now that is the funniest thing I have heard in a long time.

Peace

I'm beginning to agree with WWTB.
First j I have never said one word about me getting or not getting assignments because of AMLU member actions. In fact I specifically said it has not affected me. It is not a personal battle I'm fighting here. For me, it's merely a discussion on a relevant topic to umpiring.
My posts have spoken to the issues of the strike relative to replacements and the responsibilities of the membership of AMLU.

2 questions.
Are the AMLU umps that are working amateur games supporting or opposing the replacements?
If the answer is supporting I commend them.
If the answer is opposing, in your world deep beneath the sand, do you see any hypocrisy at all, even a little bit?

[WhatWuzThatBlue]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Not only did I receive an email, I talked directly to the people that sent out the email. I had drinks with the very people that sent out personal emails about the situation. There are two Minor League Umpires that work Basketball and we have been talking about this issue long before it was ever talked about on this or any website. I also did not read in any email that said they would not work any games of any kind under any circumstances. I was one of many that were asked directly by one assignor, "What do you think about me giving games to Minor League umpires games at our level?" Woooowwwww, I did not get a call. Man, how is my life going to go on? Peace

Man, you can't read. You just wrote that you did not get a call asking you to work MiLB assignments. You also wrote that you did not receive the email that most of us did - the pseudo form letter - urging us to honor the strike. (That email has been posted here and other places. It specifically stated that they wouldn't work amateur level games since they were professionals.) Some of us received multiple copies of this plea and pledge. Maybe if you focused a little you would be able to follow along.

You refer to conversations with FVB9 regarding assigning those guys if they go on strike (Wow, do you think he would turn his back on his friends?). Again, that's not the call that some of us received and I referred to! You were not called to work as a replacement and wrote some smart *** reply without knowing all of the facts. Learn to read, then type...maybe we'll give you a little creedence then. You keep proving that my name is like Viagra to you. I would roll my eyes, but the rest of the board is doing it for me.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by NIump50

I'm beginning to agree with WWTB.
First j I have never said one word about me getting or not getting assignments because of AMLU member actions. In fact I specifically said it has not affected me. It is not a personal battle I'm fighting here. For me, it's merely a discussion on a relevant topic to umpiring.
My posts have spoken to the issues of the strike relative to replacements and the responsibilities of the membership of AMLU.

Here is the thing. No one is going to change opinions based on what we say here. If you feel it is wrong for Minor League guys to take games at the amateur level, you have the right to that opinion. Just do not expect the rest of us to get on board with that point of view. I think officiating is for everyone that is asked and offered assignments. If you were an assignor then you would have that kind of say of who does your games. Half the time I just want a good umpire to show up and do the job. So I personally do not care. This is an issue for the assignor not me.

Originally Posted by NIump50

2 questions.
Are the AMLU umps that are working amateur games supporting or opposing the replacements?
If the answer is supporting I commend them.
If the answer is opposing, in your world deep beneath the sand, do you see any hypocrisy at all, even a little bit?

Once again, one issue is in the pros and with a strike. The other is dealing with amateur sports and is about working in an independent contractor relationship with who gives you the games. I do not see the two things as the same no matter how you try to dress them up. The Minor League guys actually "work" for the pro leagues. I work where and when I want to as an umpire. Not the same issue.

Peace

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by WhatWuzThatBlue

You refer to conversations with FVB9 regarding assigning those guys if they go on strike (Wow, do you think he would turn his back on his friends?). Again, that's not the call that some of us received and I referred to! You were not called to work as a replacement and wrote some smart *** reply without knowing all of the facts. Learn to read, then type...maybe we'll give you a little creedence then. You keep proving that my name is like Viagra to you. I would roll my eyes, but the rest of the board is doing it for me.

Why are you so obsessed with my relationship with Jeff? You act like Jeff is the only person I work for or deal with. Dude, I thought you knew me very well? I would not know what Viagra was like. I do not need such a product. You said it better than I did; your best days are behind you.

Peace

[WhatWuzThatBlue]

My worst days are still better than your best.

You just tripped on your d*ck dude. You couldn't admit that you didn't read the entire post and then sidestepped it again. I don't care which assignor called you about assigning plum pickers. It still isn't what we were discussing. The fact remains, you don't know what you are talking about regarding this strike.

Admit it, you see my name and it gets you foaming at the mouth. Everyone can read and your retorts are getting ridiculous. You are so hell bent on proving that you know more that you fail to read what is written. You should hear what people really say about you. You may think that you are on the inside but it's just a game that they are playing at your expense. It's awfully funny.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by WhatWuzThatBlue

My worst days are still better than your best.

You just tripped on your d*ck dude. You couldn't admit that you didn't read the entire post and then sidestepped it again. I don't care which assignor called you about assigning plum pickers. It still isn't what we were discussing. The fact remains, you don't know what you are talking about regarding this strike.

It is clear that this is way more of an issue for you. I really do not care either way; my income is not based on this strike either way it goes.

Originally Posted by WhatWuzThatBlue

Admit it, you see my name and it gets you foaming at the mouth. Everyone can read and your retorts are getting ridiculous. You are so hell bent on proving that you know more that you fail to read what is written. You should hear what people really say about you. You may think that you are on the inside but it's just a game that they are playing at your expense. It's awfully funny.

My season will be over in about a week. Who cares what people think of my opinion on this?

Peace

[WhatWuzThatBlue]

Did anyone else notice the Rutledge two step?

When you can't answer the query it is best to change the subject. Thanks for the laugh, Jeff. You didn't know it, but your season was finished long ago.

[WhatWuzThatBlue]

NI,
Just so you know...not all amateur umpires are considered independent contractors. In Illinois, that is the predominant view of High School umpires, but many recreational leagues employ a crew of umpires and treat them as employees. Several of the larger house leagues and more than a few village baseball associations have regular staffs that are controlled by boards. They have rights and benefits as such and often have waiting lists to become part of those crews.

The issue that was raised concerning the AMLU pros deciding to reneg on the promise is troubling. While they didn't sign en masse, the statement was issued by the union, posted on their site and distributed to mass media outlets. While I'm certain that individuals have different views from their leadership, it doesn't entitle them to break the offer free from admonishment. They want the benefits of the unions but not the constraints of the situation. Few of us were fooled by the ploy. It bothers me to think that those plum pickers are accepting those assignments. The amateurs didn't turn their backs on them. How would one of them feel if all season long, they consistently graded at the top of their league only to have a WUA crew come in and work the championship series and All Star games? That's right, they would be pissed at someone swooping in and grabbing the glory games.