Hockey Style masks or Traditional??

[nickrego]

Originally Posted by Tim C

"The traditional mask, because of how it is worn, transfers the impact to the forehead and more so the chin (jaw)."

This is not a true statement if you wear your traditional mask correctly.

Tim,

I'm afraid your reputation does nothing for you on this one. I have enough Mechanical Engineering experience to confidently say, you are DEAD WRONG.

Think about it; A mask has two pads, where the contact points are the Forehead and Jaw, for a properly fitted and worn mask. Now your going to actually state, in public, with a straight face, that the energy from a ball hitting a mask is not going to be transfered to the ONLY two contact points, the Forehead and Jaw ?

Where is it going to be transfered to, your cup ?

Here is the crux of the debate;

Old guys = Mask

Young guys = Helmet

The young guys are going to win this one, because the old guys are going to die before the young guys. I am 47, and I have been wearing a mask since I was 44 (still a young guy).

But keep fighting for your right to wear a mask. Just make sure your argument is valid. I would even accept, "I refuse to try it, think about it, or watch someone wearing one." At least it would be sincere.

[Tim C]

I don't think I said anywhere in my post that I was against wearing the HSM.

That's old news.

I am simply saying that mask manufacturers believe that a mask should work much like an F1 race car and disapate the energy of the strike by having the mask spin or fly off your face.

Even the MLB guy (sorry Nick I forget which one) that was injured last year admitted freely that he had been wearing his mask "too tight."

I have passed the emotional side of iffin' a guy wears a HSM or traditional mask . . . I see you haven't.

Regards,

[GrizzlyUmp14]

I have always worn the hockey-style mask. I had a foul ball hit my shoulder pad and bounced toward my head. Luckily, it deflected off part of my helmet and just barely hit my face. If I was wearing a traditional mask, I'm sure it would have been a lot worse. I love the increased protection and I feel that I have excellent vision (which is really important!)

[greymule]

I guess I wore the mask correctly, because mine often spun, sometimes completely off, when a pitch hit it right, and I can't remember ever really getting my bell rung (except once from a thrown bat). This year I decided to get the All-Star UMP2000 helmet. On the plus side: better vision; protection on the back, top, and sides—not a trivial benefit; quite comfortable; definitely less jolt. The minuses: harder to remove (though with the vision it provides, you can leave it on); harder to get on, as you have to see that the straps are straight, and then you have to position the back plate; and the worst thing about it, a very loud rattle in the ears if the pitch hits the cage hard. We haven't had any hot days yet here in NJ, so I can't comment on how it will feel in August.

Guy around here found his grandfather's mask from the 1930s. No way did that one get spun. It felt as if it must have weighed 6 or 8 pounds.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by greymule

...I can't remember ever really getting my bell rung (except once from a thrown bat).

Were you umpiring Delmon Young at the time?

[nickrego]

A Mask is not going to spin off if you take a direct hit, say from an untouched fastball. Your Forehead and Jaw are going to take all the energy, and you are going to feel it.

Yes, if a ball hits you from an angle, like a foul ball, or a ball that grazes off the catcher, your mask will spin off, and take some of the energy with it. But who wants a rug burn, and a bent nose from that ?

Look, wear what you will, I don't care. But just as if we were talking about a RULE, we need to get the facts correct, for those who have no experience with both pieces of equipment. There just is no comparison of the way the ball's energy is transfered between a Mask vs. Helmet. They are engineered differently.

If someone was stating inaccurate information about a chest protector, I was take the same stance. It is important that the information on this board is accurate, and informative. Just trying to do my part.

[bellsjc]

I have always used a mask. I have used the Plus Pos Zero Grav. for three years now. I love the fact that it is very light and the single bar gives me a pretty good field of view. For some reason this year, I have been getting killed behind the plate. I have been doing mostly Varsity ball so I can't blame the catchers. Almost all of my hits have been fouls. At my game this past Monday, I took a foul off my right forearm. I usually don't bruise real easily but this thing got ugly. I was showing it off to my partner last night and told him to take notice as to where I was setting up because I was getting killed this year. He reached into his trunk and pulled out the HSM he got this year. I showed him my zero grav. and he said he liked how light it was but would never go back to the mask. Well the game progressed and once again I took a beating. I got hit in the shoulder from a foul that bounced off the close back stop. Took two fouls off the mask, and the decisive blow was a ball in the dirt, that the catcher never touched. It bounced up and hit me on the right side of my jaw! If I had on a HSM I don't think it could have got me. Next year I will look for the best, lightest HSM on the market. If any of you can recommend one, please give a hollar. I don't care how much it costs I want the lightest one possible.

[JRutledge]

Nick,

I think you have waaaaayyyyy too much invested in this discussion. I have worn a mask and I have taken foul balls off the mask and the mask spun around and I hardly felt a thing. I am sure the type of mask pad and weight of the mask might have some effect on whether you "feel" the blow of the baseball. Who cares in the end? All this is anyway is an opinion. It means little to me or anyone else that uses any equipment. If you like the helmet so much than use the damn helmet. I will not use a helmet and I do not like the overall feel and look of the helmets. Now those are facts from my experience and that is why many umpires have not made the switch. How many times is this issue going to be debated as if we are talking about global warming?

Peace

[LMan]

Originally Posted by bellsjc

Next year I will look for the best, lightest HSM on the market. If any of you can recommend one, please give a hollar. I don't care how much it costs I want the lightest one possible.

I'll be right pleased to take that Zero Grav off your hands when you get ready to sell, let me know

[Rich]

Originally Posted by nickrego

Tim,

I'm afraid your reputation does nothing for you on this one. I have enough Mechanical Engineering experience to confidently say, you are DEAD WRONG.

Think about it; A mask has two pads, where the contact points are the Forehead and Jaw, for a properly fitted and worn mask. Now your going to actually state, in public, with a straight face, that the energy from a ball hitting a mask is not going to be transfered to the ONLY two contact points, the Forehead and Jaw ?

Where is it going to be transfered to, your cup ?

Here is the crux of the debate;

Old guys = Mask

Young guys = Helmet

The young guys are going to win this one, because the old guys are going to die before the young guys. I am 47, and I have been wearing a mask since I was 44 (still a young guy).

But keep fighting for your right to wear a mask. Just make sure your argument is valid. I would even accept, "I refuse to try it, think about it, or watch someone wearing one." At least it would be sincere.

The thing you aren't hearing from Tim is that a mask, WORN PROPERLY, will cause the same amount of pain and discomfort when hit as the HSM. None. A mask is designed to be worn loose and, when hit, it's supposed to spin up and off the face.

If you like the HSM, fine, but don't act like it's more dangerous to choose the mask, cause it isn't.

BTW, I wear a HSM.......cause I think the VISION is better -- for no other reason.