Arguing

[David Emerling]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Many coaches are under the assumption that if they argue that maybe they will get the next close call. That is a false assumption. The only thing arguing with the umpire does is piss off the umpire. Maybe it fires up the team morale a bit, but mostly just pisses off the umpire.

You're right - some coaches are under that assumption. But, depending on the personality and experience of the umpire, this could very well be a valid assumption.

I know many timid umpires who just want to get through the game as easily as a possible and with no hassles.

If a coach is pressing them hard, they WILL bend.

Example: Critical situation - bases loaded - full count on the batter - a close pitch on the outside corner that the batter takes. Very close - could probably go either way.

A timid umpire will be hyper-aware that if he calls it a certain way he is going to get an earful from the coach who has been riding his *** the whole game. So he takes the path of least resistance. An umpire like this may not even be fully aware that he has been intimidated into making that call.

Now, a different umpire, with a different personality might make this call AGAINST the red-*** coach for the same reasons.

Sometimes coaches are very good at sizing up an umpire's abilities, experience, temperament, and assertiveness. They'll model their behavior so that they have the best chance of getting their way. That same red-*** coach may calmly schmooze a different umpire. They can be like chameleons.

In short, putting the full court press on the umpire sometimes DOES gain some benefits.

David Emerling
Memphis, TN

[JRutledge]

A lot of times in baseball games there is not a "next close call." Just this year I have had game after game after game where there were hardly any close calls. In most of those cases the plays were not "either or" calls. Just in my doubleheader on Saturday there was not one play I had either on the bases or on the plate. The only close call my partner might have had was a pitch or two and they did not complain until the game was almost over.

I think often times coaches complain just to complain. I have had coaches many times come out to complain only to have them admit 2 seconds in the conversation "You know I am complaining just to look good right?" Then they walk away and they do not complain about another play all day. Also I do not see the experience of the coach as a factor as if they complain or not. Coaches will try umpires they have never seen before and if they feel they can intimidate an umpire they will try. When the coach realizes the umpire is not going to budge or is not intimidated then go back into their "hole."

Peace

[kraine27]

In my opinion, coaches in High School baseball should remember that the ball field is an extension of the class room. All participants of the game, not just the coaches, need to keep in mind that our actions are being watched by teenagers. In Kansas, we have a few coaches who come out guns blazing on all close plays, regardless of the outcome, regardless of the situation, but, for the most part, our better coaches with strong programs only come out to ask questions about rule interps or what you saw on a particular play.

I can honestly say that in my ten years of umpiring HS baseball, I have not ever had to have an ejection (I say this as I knock on my wodden desk). That's the way it should be in high school ball.

[RPatrino]

I would have to agree. At the Varsity level the veteran coach's know how to deal with umpires. I never assume that they will "NEVER" argue with me, particularly if I don't hustle or show them that I am working hard. I believe that if you do your best and give 110% you should have few problems. I have had coach's ask me about plays and rulings, they might have disagreed, but they accept my decisions and moved on. We have ex major league and high level college players coaching in our area, and that makes a difference.

Now, in sub varsity and youth ball I have found that the level of composure and behavior deteriorates as you move down. I attribute that to lack of experience and motivation, where the youth ball coach tends to want to live vicariously through their kids and they try to emulate the things they see on TV.

I had that in a Pony level game this weekend, where the coach wanted to try to extend his "authority" to include the umpire crew. We went into "red aXX" mode in a quick hurry and he figured it out very quickly. Some are quick learner's, and the slower ones learn from the parking lot. Its sort of like Darwinism.

Bob P.

[David Emerling]

At least in Tennessee, the school is fined a minimum of $250 each time a coach is ejected. The fine can be higher if it's particularly egregious.

The coach generally has to answer to the Athletic Director or Principal. This, in itself, often keeps their behavior in check.

A school simply can't AFFORD to have a Lou Pinella type of coach.

David Emerling
Memphis, TN

[Justme]

Originally Posted by David Emerling

At least in Tennessee, the school is fined a minimum of $250 each time a coach is ejected. The fine can be higher if it's particularly egregious.

The coach generally has to answer to the Athletic Director or Principal. This, in itself, often keeps their behavior in check.

A school simply can't AFFORD to have a Lou Pinella type of coach.

David Emerling
Memphis, TN

I like that.....a lot!

[O.T.Hill]

I have to weigh in on this one, being a relatively inexperienced umpire, yet still getting my fair share of NFHS varsity baseball games. The coaches that will sort of sidle up to me between innings and ask if I was "sure" about a call will really earn my respect in an instant compared to guys who will either show me up on the field or continually comment from the dugout. Usually, I will say either, "I'm sure, man." or "It was close." and they're pretty satisfied either way. The one thing that's tough is when coaches come to me to complain about my partner. I realize that I used to do that all the time when I coached. I know they're just looking for some sympathy, but I always just say something like, "He's doing fine, and I've got enough to worry about myself."

[O.T.Hill]

Really quick I want to follow up with a question. How does everyone feel about HP admitting that he probably missed a pitch? I miss my share, and it seems as though it's usually a pitch that I should have called a strike and didn't. Two or three times this year, I have simply stated for batter and catcher to hear: "Boys, that was a good pitch." I guess it makes me feel better, I don't know. Another instance in a recent game had ball one come in at the knees and I thought I missed it, calling it a "ball". Next pitch comes in just high - "ball". Both pitches the pitcher expressed just the slightest bit of a puzzled look. Pitch # 3 was fouled off down the left field line. As I skipped out from behind the plate and moved a little closer to the mound, the pitcher had moved in pretty close to the plate. As I flipped him the new ball, I said, "I missed the first pitch." His reply: "No problem". This was around the second inning. No problems whatsoever the rest of the way.
Is this just a plain stupid thing to do on my part?

[LMan]

Originally Posted by David Emerling

Now, a different umpire, with a different personality might make this call AGAINST the red-*** coach for the same reasons.

someone call my name?

[bossman72]

Some coaches, especially youth coaches, think they have to be Bobby Cox and come out and scream at the umpires for every close play. This hurts the team more than it helps.