Positions B and C

[O.T.Hill]

I know there have been changes regarding BU in 2-man mechanics and when he sets up in the B position or C position. Can someone give me a current, solid FED guideline of when BU should be in the C position?

[DG]

Originally posted by O.T.Hill
I know there have been changes regarding BU in 2-man mechanics and when he sets up in the B position or C position. Can someone give me a current, solid FED guideline of when BU should be in the C position?

I try not to read the FED recommendations on positions. I would be in C with runner on 3B only, runners on 2nd and 3rd, runners on 1st and 2nd, and bases loaded. For runners on 1st and 3rd I would be in B, and I think the FED manual shows C for this situation and that's probably the main difference between FED and others (CCA and PBUC).

[SanDiegoSteve]

For me, the same as DG, except I prefer C for all 1st and 3rd situations.

[Edited by SanDiegoSteve on Mar 16th, 2006 at 09:24 PM]

[SanDiegoSteve]

San Diego County Baseball Umpires Association mechanic: B or C, umpire's preference.

1986 Pro School (Harry's and Joe's): C. B had yet to even be discussed in those days. I have a hard time in B, probably because I started out working C originally, and being an old dog, a new trick just didn't catch on.

[ManInBlue]

What do you recommend for R2 only?

[briancurtin]

Originally posted by ManInBlue
What do you recommend for R2 only?

C

[ManInBlue]

Originally posted by briancurtin

C

That's what I use. Thanks -

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by DG

I try not to read the FED recommendations on positions. I would be in C with runner on 3B only, runners on 2nd and 3rd, runners on 1st and 2nd, and bases loaded. For runners on 1st and 3rd I would be in B, and I think the FED manual shows C for this situation and that's probably the main difference between FED and others (CCA and PBUC).

Some states put BU in C only when a steal of third is possible (i.e., R1,R2 or R2 only). Otherwise they put BU in B.

So, to the original question -- we (someone) can give the "pure FED" answer -- but that might not be what's used in your state / area.

[orioles35]

With R2, doesn't C interfere with the baserunner's line of sight with the pitcher?

[midtnblu]

If I'm in R2's line of sight with the pitcher when I'm in C...

A) he's hung out to dry cuz he's got a huge lead and

B) If he can't see over me (hands on knees) he's not old enough to be leading off.

[NIump50]

Originally posted by bob jenkins
[/B][/QUOTE]

Some states put BU in C only when a steal of third is possible (i.e., R1,R2 or R2 only). Otherwise they put BU in B.[/B]

I agree with this mechanic. I'm only in C when r2 can steal 3rd. In all other cases the likelihood of a play at 3rd is much less than at any other base, therefore B position gives you the best look.

[briancurtin]

Originally posted by orioles35
With R2, doesn't C interfere with the baserunner's line of sight with the pitcher?

if this is the case, take a step in towards home plate. problem solved.

[NIump50]

Originally posted by Tim C
No written official mechanic document says to use the philosophy as expounded by NIUmp.

Not the NAPL manual, not the CCA book, not the Federation Umpire Manual.

If it works in your local area and it is accepted, USE IT. Otherwise stick to what has been researched, documented and tested over time.

I did a quick check on 2 states IL and NH that have mechanics available online and both teach and endorse pos b in all cases, with men on base, except r1 and R2, or r2 only.

Perhaps they are rogue states teaching a bad mechanic that hasn't been tested, but it makes sense to me. If you're playing the per centages this mechanic puts you in the best position and after all isn't that what we are striving for?

[Edited by NIump50 on Mar 17th, 2006 at 01:16 PM]

[nickrego]

Runner on 1st: B
Standard

Runner on 2nd: C
Standard

Runner on 3rd: B
Puts me closer to 1st (where the play is most likely)
Calling a “Pick-Play” at 3rd is no different from
calling a “Pick-Play” at 1st from C

Runner on 1st & 2nd: C
Standard

Runner on 1st & 3rd: B
Puts me in position for a play at 1st, 2nd,
or double play at 1st & 2nd
(where the play is most likely)

Runner on 1st, 2nd & 3rd: B
Puts me in position for a play at 1st, 2nd,
or double play (where the play is most likely)

These are the preferred 2-Man mechanics of our High School association, and I prefer them.

I think Papa C. has a rhyme about being in C, but I couldn’t find it at the moment.

Something like;

B oh B, how I hate to be in C !

[NIump50]

Originally posted by Tim C
Dave Yeast said it far better than I could have:

"Any umpire that feels he has to start in "B" to get to the next play when he was supposed to start from "C" isn't much of an umpire.

"An umpire can move from "C" to the exact same position that is attained by starting incorrectly in "B".

"We have studied starting positions over the years and have selected, with much thought, where we want umpires to be."

Of course that is just his opinion.

If you're implying that anyone that uses the mechanic I sugested is a bad umpire it's a shame you have to go there instead of discussing the pros and cons of both.

I simply stated the facts as I see them.

1. At least two states endorse and teach this mechanic. I'm sure there are many more I simply have not done the research.

2. The per centages work in favor of this mechanic.

If you disagree with any of these 2 statements I think it would be an interesting discussion.

Perhaps the mechanic I'm using is not as effective as the old style. Could you please point me to the research and testing you previously refered to so I can better evaluate the two mechanics.
Thanks