PRESEASON JITTERS – NEED HELP

[irefky]

Originally posted by MrB

Pat,

The SR evaluator that is trying to help you improve as an official isn't doing a very good job of focusing on the right thing. I mean, rules interpratation and knowledge, judgement, positioning, situations, any of this type of stuff then ok, listen to him, but style? You're working a new level of ball for you and he is worried about your style? Come on!

There is nothing wrong with the point at all, and many top college and professional umpires point. In fact I worked a Div 1 series this past weekend and all 3 umpires on the crew pointed. Infact I have worked roughly 25 Div 1 games and another dozen JC games this season and every single umpire pointed.

Point is a strike, hammer is an out. Safest thing to do IMO.

I also agree, it's a comfort that we have. Of course we all remember this past baseball series when the umpire done the hammer thing, I am sure he has thought about changing that. Tough to do for someone who has done it for so long.

[MrB]

Originally posted by Tim C
This past weekend at the 3 day Evans Clinic it was taught that a strike call is a personal selection. The only taboo is to NEVER turn to the side to make the call. ALWAYS keep shoulders square to the field and make "a" strike call.

Seems pretty simple to me. Can't wait for one of the six "all time" crew chime in.

But, of course, this is just my opinion.

The NEVER turn thing is also just a suggestion and a very good one for an umpire that has poor timing. I have talked with Jim about this and he agreed that with proper timing this is not a bad or forbidden mechanic. I turn with no action and stay straight ahead with action. It takes good timing but it can be done with no problem.

[Tim C]

Have you talked with him since Sunday afternoon?

Sunday afternoon, when asked this exact question he said:

"There is no reason to look to the side . . . never call a strike to the side."

Maybe you have more recent information than we were given.

[MrB]

Originally posted by Tim C
Have you talked with him since Sunday afternoon?

Sunday afternoon, when asked this exact question he said:

"There is no reason to look to the side . . . never call a strike to the side."

Maybe you have more recent information than we were given.

Nope, not since then. But his info helped get me ranked #2 at PBUC several moon's ago, and the number one thing they liked was Plate Work, Strike zone, Mechanic and style, oh yeah and timing.

I point this out because those that worry about style over the nuts and bolts of umpiring are worrying about the wrong thing. If turning causes problems, don't do it; if it doesn't, then don't change it.

Again, over 75% of the guys I have worked with in Pro ball and NCAA, point and turn when appropriate.

JM $0.02

[Edited by MrB on Mar 9th, 2006 at 03:14 PM]

[LMan]

<<<<<<<< pointer

our trainer prefers the point so there's no confusion with an 'out' call.

[Justme]

Originally posted by btman
why not point straight up and watch the game? that's what we are paid to do not showboat. Like the bow string, thats showboating shwing the batter up. we get all out of whack when we get showed up then do it to a batter? just call that third strike,point up or fist up and keep your head in the game.

Point straight up? I've never seen that mechanic. Do you really point straight up or use the hammer motion?

No 3rd strike mechanic like the 'bow string' because it might show up the batter? Do you really think that you're showing up the batter and showboating? I haven't seen many (if any) umpires that don't have their own 'special' 3rd strike mechanic.

[irefky]

I think the strike 3 mechanic should be different. I don't think it is the umpire showing any one up, but letting everyone know that he has an out.

We do it on a foul after a made shot in basketball

We do it on a close picof off play on an out in baseball

We do it on a close play at the bag in baseball

We do it on a close TD in football

I just think those are different and carry weight, just MO

I have the bow on a batter looking, and a out signal after a swinging strike 3

[briancurtin]

Originally posted by btman
yes, arm goes up in a fist or in a point. I meant what I said all this big whoppdedo about making a huge deal out of a thrid strike, for what? we were told to stop saying "you're out" now we have this super showboat move for what reason?

i thought raising your fist straight up in the air was reserved for softball...

[Rich]

Originally posted by btman

yes, arm goes up in a fist or in a point. I meant what I said all this big whoppdedo about making a huge deal out of a thrid strike, for what? we were told to stop saying "you're out" now we have this super showboat move for what reason?

Some of us never said "you're out."

[BigUmp56]

Originally posted by btman

yes, arm goes up in a fist or in a point. I meant what I said all this big whoppdedo about making a huge deal out of a thrid strike, for what? we were told to stop saying "you're out" now we have this super showboat move for what reason?

Before any of you get too invloved debating with this pathetic troll you should know something. btman is either Walter Rucker or his employee Donovan Hammond here playing games. This person registered on my forum and used three aliases and six different IP addresses to try and stir up some trouble. More than likely this is also the same person who had has his account deteted recently here as John Hastings. I know this because two the IP's used by Donovan Hammond matched up exactly with one of the IP's btman was using.

I wonder if we'll ever be rid of this jerk.


Tim.

[Edited by BigUmp56 on Mar 9th, 2006 at 09:46 PM]

[PAT THE REF]

Thanks everyone for your input... I am prob. going to keep my point mechanic...

One more question about the partner situation - Im working JV, and the school assigned me (and schools here in NJ for JV dont assign a position just that you will officiate the game)
I arrive 30 mins to game time.... my partner doesnt show up
its now 20 minutes to game time....

when do you suit up for the plate? what if your assigned to the bases? when do you just suit up?

Pat

[DG]

Originally posted by PAT THE REF
Thanks everyone for your input... I am prob. going to keep my point mechanic...

One more question about the partner situation - Im working JV, and the school assigned me (and schools here in NJ for JV dont assign a position just that you will officiate the game)
I arrive 30 mins to game time.... my partner doesnt show up
its now 20 minutes to game time....

when do you suit up for the plate? what if your assigned to the bases? when do you just suit up?

Pat

It's fairly standard here to call your partners for the week on Sunday night to discuss logistics. If who does what has not been established then do it then so you will know. So in your example, if I arrive 30 minutes to game time and my partner has the plate I am dressing for bases. If he does not show by 15 minutes to game time I will start to change and get serious about it at 12 minutes to game time. If he shows after I am dressed for plate, I am working plate.

[David Emerling]

This is my first year as a "pointer". I have always used the first as my strike mechanic.

The ALCS incident with Doug Eddings was a wake-up call for me. And *should* be for all the hammer guys out there.

The fact that a strike mechanic is IDENTICAL to an out mechanic can cause serious problems in certain circumstances.

Everybody who uses the hammer as their standard strike mechanic needs to ask themselves, "How would *I* have handled the same situation that Doug Eddings found him in?"

I have seen this topic discussed much on various internet umpire forums and I really haven't read what I considered a particularly good mechanic that maintains the hammer as the primary strike mechanic. Almost every solution involved a lot of TALKING since there is no signal remaining that describes the situation.

So, now, I point. I point for the strike and I hammer for the out. It's clearer to the participants and fans.

David Emerling
Memphis, TN

[briancurtin]

Originally posted by David Emerling
The ALCS incident with Doug Eddings was a wake-up call for me. And *should* be for all the hammer guys out there.

im not sure i agree with this. i wont be changing anything this season, i see no need to. i use the hammer, and i use it effectively. there is not, or i should say there hasnt been, any confusion for me when using the hammer on a third strike not caught. not everyone uses the hammer exactly as eddings does.

[David Emerling]

Originally posted by briancurtin

im not sure i agree with this. i wont be changing anything this season, i see no need to. i use the hammer, and i use it effectively. there is not, or i should say there hasnt been, any confusion for me when using the hammer on a third strike not caught. not everyone uses the hammer exactly as eddings does.

I would be curious as to your handling of this exact situation. I'm not challenging - I'm sincerely curious because I can be convinced to return to the "hammer" if somebody could come up with an acceptable mechanic that is not prone to confusion.

The batter swings and misses a pitch that is low.

You signal strike with a hammer?

Then, as the PU, you are convinced (a) the ball was caught, or (b) the ball was *not* caught.

What further signals (or verbalization) will you make for (a) or (b)?

David Emerling
Memphis, TN