foul tip

[scyguy]

Is a ball that hits the ground then hits a swinging bat considered a batted ball? For example, two strikes, F1 pitches ball in dirt, batter swings and makes contact after ball hit ground. Ball goes directly to catcher. Foul tip?

I cannot find any reference to states that a ball is no longer a batted ball just because it hit the ground first.

[Tim C]

A very agressive thread exposed this play quite well.

We know that a ball can be hit after it bounces (good clip about that right fielder fella from the Mariners is played on ESPN etc) for a hit or an out.

When this first issue (your question)came up Rick Roder noted that the ball COULD NOT BE CAUGHT for a foul tip.

When informed of this Jim Evans basically lost it. His position was that any ball that could be hit for a home run would also have the penalty part of the rule also.

Roder then noted that he would consult with Major League Umpires.

Roder then came back and said, "it appears that I may have been incorrect -- I am talking with all MLB umpires and will get back to you."

Roder came back a few days later and explained that he was incorrect in his first interpretation and, in fact, the ball could be caught for a foul tip.

I give you this long version since it is important sometimes to see how some of the opinions stated here are developed.

A ball that bounces can be a hit batter, a ball, a swinging strike or hit safely or into an out . . . the same bouncing ball can indeed become a "foul tip."

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by scyguy
Is a ball that hits the ground then hits a swinging bat considered a batted ball? For example, two strikes, F1 pitches ball in dirt, batter swings and makes contact after ball hit ground. Ball goes directly to catcher. Foul tip?

I cannot find any reference to states that a ball is no longer a batted ball just because it hit the ground first.

Yes, it's a batted ball.

[cbfoulds]

Originally posted by Tim C
/SNIP.../
A ball that bounces can be a hit batter, a ball, a swinging strike or hit safely or into an out . . . the same bouncing ball can indeed become a "foul tip."

Tee:
Just for my own clarity, I thought it was still agreed that a bounced pitch still could not be "caught" for a [swing & miss] 3d strike. That still true?

[Tim C]

cb asks:

"I thought it was still agreed that a bounced pitch still could not be "caught" for a [swing & miss] 3d strike. That still true?"
----------------------------------------------------------

That is NOT true. Once a foul tip always a foul tip.

Even Roder joined this interpretation at the end.

Evans was very vocal about the first false ruling.

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

I will leave this post here as a testiment to the fact that I cannot read.

I missed cb point. Ignore this post.

T



[Edited by Tim C on Mar 11th, 2005 at 09:32 PM]

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by cbfoulds
Just for my own clarity, I thought it was still agreed that a bounced pitch still could not be "caught" for a [swing & miss] 3d strike. That still true?

I think Tee missed something, because this is the only thing it can't be.

[ozzy6900]

Originally posted by scyguy
Is a ball that hits the ground then hits a swinging bat considered a batted ball? For example, two strikes, F1 pitches ball in dirt, batter swings and makes contact after ball hit ground. Ball goes directly to catcher. Foul tip?

I cannot find any reference to states that a ball is no longer a batted ball just because it hit the ground first.

In Men's Slo-Pitch Softball, a pitch that hits the ground cannot be struck at - it is a dead ball.

But here in the baseball world, the same pitch can be offered at and hit as a normal pitch. It cannot however become a dropped third strike or a foul tip. In the latter case, it is mearly a foul ball.

[scyguy]

do you have a FED rule reference for that Ozzy?

[cbfoulds]

Originally posted by Tim C
cb asks:

"I thought it was still agreed that a bounced pitch still could not be "caught" for a [swing & miss] 3d strike. That still true?"
----------------------------------------------------------

That is NOT true. Once a foul tip always a foul tip.

Even Roder joined this interpretation at the end.

Evans was very vocal about the first false ruling.

Whoa, Tee:
I WAS one of the "no foul-tip" crew, but I'm not stupid enough to argue with Roder AND Evans. I accept the foul-tip ruling.

My question was about the swing and a miss [wiff] no-contact-with-the-bat sitch:

No runners on; batter with 2 strikes-
Pitch bounces in front of the plate-
Batter swings and misses completely -
F2 gloves the ball cleanly.

True or false: this is NOT a "caught 3d Strike", Batter may run, not out unless tagged or thrown out @ 1st [or enters dugout, etc.]?

THAT's what I was asking about!

[DG]

Pitch that bounces swung at and missed, catcher "catches" on the one hop. Batter may try for first if conditions merit (ie 1B open, etc.)

Pitch in the dirt swung at and tipped after the bounce, catcher "catches" on the one hop. Batter is out.

[Tim C]

Emily Latella would say, "Nevermine" . . . sorry cb I misread your question.

My bad and my humble apology for failing to read things correctly.

[JJ]

If you want a FED definition of this situation, look up "Foul Tip" in the Definitions section. It's a ball that goes directly from the bat to the catcher's glove (and is caught by etc etc). The ball that hits the ground first, then goes from the bat to the catcher's glove meets the criteria of the definition.

[jicecone]

Originally posted by Tim C
Emily Latella would say, "Nevermine" . . . sorry cb I misread your question.

My bad and my humble apology for failing to read things correctly.

God are you mellowing out!!!!!!!!

[Tim C]

Hehehehe,

Just new and improved.

[mbyron]

Don't call Tee 'God'. That goes straight to his head.