3 MLB Umps Rehired...

Peruvian · #1 (**permalink**) Fri Dec 24, 2004, 06:34pm

...8 more got severance and back pay, including 'Balkin'' Bob Davidson.

Good for them. I hope Richie Phillips has a nice Christmas...he ought to be personally responsible for his actions, not the umps.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=1953109

ASA/NYSSOBLUE · #2 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 02:01pm

Nice to see that guys like Gregg and Kaiser are getting their bennies back too (AND some cash)...met Kaiser at a book signing at a Rochester Red Wings game once,and he seems to be a real nice guy...looks like SOMEbody at MLB is trying to treat the umps right finally...

mrm21711 · #3 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 11:22pm

Quote:

Originally posted by ASA/NYSSOBLUE
Nice to see that guys like Gregg and Kaiser are getting their bennies back too (AND some cash)...met Kaiser at a book signing at a Rochester Red Wings game once,and he seems to be a real nice guy...looks like SOMEbody at MLB is trying to treat the umps right finally...

I disagree.

Unless Phillips resigned them himself, they have nobody to answer to but themselves. The umpires resigned themselves, without questioning their "leader." Umpires like Tim McClelland and others who did not resign should be praised and commended for their intelligence.

edhern · #4 (**permalink**) Sun Dec 26, 2004, 12:03am

Personally, I am glad Ed Hickox will get his job back. He is a great guy and an excellent teacher. I had the pleasure to attend a clinic where he taught. I saw how it hurt him to be out of the game.

Ed H

PS2Man · #5 (**permalink**) Sun Dec 26, 2004, 02:27am

If the umpires during the Phillip's reign were not so arrogant, they would not have lost their jobs in the first place. They should have realized that there were many just waiting for a change to take their position. How stupid they were. The just better be glad that someone decided to give them a break. If you ask me they got what they deserved.

senior · #6 (**permalink**) Sun Dec 26, 2004, 07:47pm

Bob Davidson was quoted as saying he realized he needed Baseball more than it needed him.

I'm sure the three due for reinstatement will be even better than they were before the "resignations". A lesson about who to listen to is sometimes a bitter pill to swallow, and this sad case is working toward a decent outcome.

Senior

Dave Davies · #7 (**permalink**) Mon Dec 27, 2004, 04:26am

PS2man sez,

"If the umpires during the Phillip's reign were not so arrogant, they would not have lost their jobs in the first place. They should have realized that there were many just waiting for a change to take their position. How stupid they were. The just better be glad that someone decided to give them a break. If you ask me they got what they deserved."

You know for a fact that it was "arrogance" that got these guys fired and "they deserved what they got."

Sounds like you have inside information on the working of MLB and their conflicts with Richie "Arrogant" Philips. Why don't you enlighten us and tell us what you know?

The gentlemen that got caught up in this are exemplary and exceptional individuals that trusted their union leader. That was a mistake. even naive. But, "Stupid"? I know that you have never made any mistakes and you are about to enlighten us with your knowledge of union activity.

"They got what they deserved.? They deserved to lose their benefits? They were illegally denied their retirement packages? Sounds like you support Selig & Alderson, who intimated to one of these arrogant, stupid people that he would never see a dime of benefits and would have to use all of his retirement money to fight the lawsuits that have just now been settled.

Hopefuly, you won't lose your ability to practice your profession when there is a union/management conflict of which you will have no control.

The umpires that should be scrutinized more closely are the ones who resigned initially. When the going got tough, they turned tail and recanted their resignations. Gutless.

One of the umpires who is no longer in the game told me that he is personally very happy for the young guys who came up and filled the slots. You should just hope to have this guys courage, pride and integrity.

Dave Davies
***************

gordon30307 · #8 (**permalink**) Mon Dec 27, 2004, 10:42am

I have no sympathy for the guys that resigned. It's arrogance on their part if they thought that they were irreplaceable and bigger than the game. As a group they needed to be knocked down a peg. They were hired by the League and obligated to apply the rules the way the League wanted them applied. As I recall they refused to call the "high strike" the way the League wanted it called. I'm sure that there were other issues invovled as well. I think it was Eric Gregg with his strikes 6 inches off the black he was an embarassment to the profession the way he called strikes and his arrogance on the field was their for all to see. None of them should have been hired back. Just my opinion.

Dave Hensley · #9 (**permalink**) Mon Dec 27, 2004, 12:17pm

Quote:

Originally posted by gordon30307
I have no sympathy for the guys that resigned. It's arrogance on their part if they thought that they were irreplaceable and bigger than the game. As a group they needed to be knocked down a peg. They were hired by the League and obligated to apply the rules the way the League wanted them applied. As I recall they refused to call the "high strike" the way the League wanted it called. I'm sure that there were other issues invovled as well. I think it was Eric Gregg with his strikes 6 inches off the black he was an embarassment to the profession the way he called strikes and his arrogance on the field was their for all to see. None of them should have been hired back. Just my opinion.

And an ignorant opinion it is.

Major League Baseball didn't bust the umpires union because they wouldn't call high strikes but called strikes too far outside. Sheesh.

Leecedar · #10 (**permalink**) Mon Dec 27, 2004, 02:34pm

I am somebody who was formerly a contractor. In my business, I was subject to the arrogance of the union. In my personal life, my friend was a union member, and I got some good insight into the "union" way of things.

I'm sorry. I don't have sympathy for any union member who decides to take a job action and then suffers for that action. I feel that if the umpires in question, as employees of the MLB owners, didn't like what their boss had to instruct about the performance of their jobs, then their option was to leave their chosen jobs and take whatever ramifications came thereof. Because the positions were able to be adequately filled by others, it is obvious that the umpires made a significant error in thinking they were irreplacable.

I am not familiar enough with the terms of the benefits situation to offer an opinion as to whether the umpires should have lost their benefits, but if the "back pay" was for time in which they were involved in their job action, it's my feeling that they should remain pay-less for that period.

I believe that unionization is one of the things that has stifled the American economy, by making people equal, regardless of ability. Seniority should have NO bearing on remuneration for services. Performance should be the only foundation upon which it is laid. In a pure market economy, Darwin's theory of natural selection works perfectly. If an owner of ANY business doesn't do the right thing, his employees will go elsewhere. In turn, he will get less productive employees, devaluing his business. There's a good reason socialism hasn't worked anywhere... it's a system that reduces individual motivation. Unionism is just another form of socialism and should be abolished.

Okay, I'm off my soap box... until I have to respond to the rebuttals I'm sure I'm going to receive.

Lee

JRutledge · #11 (**permalink**) Mon Dec 27, 2004, 03:19pm

This situation is not about the unions in this country at all. This was about a bunch of people that thought no one would take their job. They did not realize or seem to realize that there were many waiting in the wings hoping for an opportunity at the show. This is the very reason every official's strike or lockout there are many lining up to take the regular's place. These guys were dumb enough to retire of all things so they could get a bargaining edge. Well it backfired big. I would have rather have lost my job trying to strike than retiring and hoping that MLB would take the bluff.

Peace

gordon30307 · #12 (**permalink**) Mon Dec 27, 2004, 05:31pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave Hensley

Quote:

Originally posted by gordon30307
I have no sympathy for the guys that resigned. It's arrogance on their part if they thought that they were irreplaceable and bigger than the game. As a group they needed to be knocked down a peg. They were hired by the League and obligated to apply the rules the way the League wanted them applied. As I recall they refused to call the "high strike" the way the League wanted it called. I'm sure that there were other issues invovled as well. I think it was Eric Gregg with his strikes 6 inches off the black he was an embarassment to the profession the way he called strikes and his arrogance on the field was their for all to see. None of them should have been hired back. Just my opinion.

And an ignorant opinion it is.

Major League Baseball didn't bust the umpires union because they wouldn't call high strikes but called strikes too far outside. Sheesh.

No Dave it was the high strike.

mrm21711 · #13 (**permalink**) Mon Dec 27, 2004, 08:02pm

Quote:

Originally posted by MrUmpire

Quote:

Originally posted by gordon30307
I have no sympathy for the guys that resigned. It's arrogance on their part if they thought that they were irreplaceable and bigger than the game. As a group they needed to be knocked down a peg. They were hired by the League and obligated to apply the rules the way the League wanted them applied. As I recall they refused to call the "high strike" the way the League wanted it called. I'm sure that there were other issues invovled as well. I think it was Eric Gregg with his strikes 6 inches off the black he was an embarassment to the profession the way he called strikes and his arrogance on the field was their for all to see. None of them should have been hired back. Just my opinion.

I regret to that I must forgo my long honored tradtion of not getting involved in name calling.

You, sir, are a moron.

How about an intelligent and factual response?? Debating the person with facts and intelligent statments earns more respect than name calling.

If the umps legally should have received the back pay, ect...they deserve it. If not, then they do not. Although MLB is being made out to be the "bad guy," the umpires resigned themselves. There is no shame in rescinding a regination when you realize what the alternative is. The Tim McClellands, Mark Hirschbecks, Derryl Cousins, and Tim Welkes should be commended for not resigning. Lets look at this situation logically. The umpires had become bigger than the game. Anybody watching the 1995 playoffs cannot argue that Eric Gregg in the Florida/Atlanta series and Brinkman in the World Series were a joke.

Jay R · #14 (**permalink**) Tue Dec 28, 2004, 11:39am

Quote:

Originally posted by mrm21711

Quote:

Originally posted by MrUmpire

Quote:

Originally posted by gordon30307
I have no sympathy for the guys that resigned. It's arrogance on their part if they thought that they were irreplaceable and bigger than the game. As a group they needed to be knocked down a peg. They were hired by the League and obligated to apply the rules the way the League wanted them applied. As I recall they refused to call the "high strike" the way the League wanted it called. I'm sure that there were other issues invovled as well. I think it was Eric Gregg with his strikes 6 inches off the black he was an embarassment to the profession the way he called strikes and his arrogance on the field was their for all to see. None of them should have been hired back. Just my opinion.

I regret to that I must forgo my long honored tradtion of not getting involved in name calling.

You, sir, are a moron.

How about an intelligent and factual response?? Debating the person with facts and intelligent statments earns more respect than name calling.

If the umps legally should have received the back pay, ect...they deserve it. If not, then they do not. Although MLB is being made out to be the "bad guy," the umpires resigned themselves. There is no shame in rescinding a regination when you realize what the alternative is. The Tim McClellands, Mark Hirschbecks, Derryl Cousins, and Tim Welkes should be commended for not resigning. Lets look at this situation logically. The umpires had become bigger than the game. Anybody watching the 1995 playoffs cannot argue that Eric Gregg in the Florida/Atlanta series and Brinkman in the World Series were a joke.

What do you mean they were a joke? This is a serious question. I was not watching baseball during that period of time, although I follow it closely now. Do you mean they were a joke by their K zone or their behavior on the field?

gordon30307 · #15 (**permalink**) Tue Dec 28, 2004, 01:10pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Jay R

Quote:

Originally posted by mrm21711

Quote:

Originally posted by MrUmpire

Quote:

Originally posted by gordon30307
I have no sympathy for the guys that resigned. It's arrogance on their part if they thought that they were irreplaceable and bigger than the game. As a group they needed to be knocked down a peg. They were hired by the League and obligated to apply the rules the way the League wanted them applied. As I recall they refused to call the "high strike" the way the League wanted it called. I'm sure that there were other issues invovled as well. I think it was Eric Gregg with his strikes 6 inches off the black he was an embarassment to the profession the way he called strikes and his arrogance on the field was their for all to see. None of them should have been hired back. Just my opinion.

I regret to that I must forgo my long honored tradtion of not getting involved in name calling.

You, sir, are a moron.

How about an intelligent and factual response?? Debating the person with facts and intelligent statments earns more respect than name calling.

If the umps legally should have received the back pay, ect...they deserve it. If not, then they do not. Although MLB is being made out to be the "bad guy," the umpires resigned themselves. There is no shame in rescinding a regination when you realize what the alternative is. The Tim McClellands, Mark Hirschbecks, Derryl Cousins, and Tim Welkes should be commended for not resigning. Lets look at this situation logically. The umpires had become bigger than the game. Anybody watching the 1995 playoffs cannot argue that Eric Gregg in the Florida/Atlanta series and Brinkman in the World Series were a joke.

What do you mean they were a joke? This is a serious question. I was not watching baseball during that period of time, although I follow it closely now. Do you mean they were a joke by their K zone or their behavior on the field?

Both.....