Taking (but not taking) signs

[BoomerSooner]

I've noticed in my son's baseball games that many pitchers have been taught to straddle the pitcher's plate until they are ready to pitch if there are runners on base. Based on watching what follows, my belief is that this is being done to help them manage runners taking a lead without the potential for a balk. When the pitcher decides he's going to pitch, he moves his pivot foot forward in contact with the pitcher's plate and then relatively quickly gets set and pitches. It isn't so quick that the batter isn't prepared, and thus I don't I think a quick pitch is warranted, so that isn't my issue. Where I'm bothered by this is that the pitchers that have been taught to do this will look at the catcher prior to contacting the plate and then wait for a runner to take a lead and then throw over to first or fake a throw hoping another runner will break for the next base. When I've asked why this is being allowed I've been told that there can't be a balk because the pitcher isn't touching his plate. When I asked about the requirement to take signs while in contact with the pitcher's plate, the response I get is that the catcher isn't giving signs so the pitcher isn't taking signs and that rule doesn't apply.

To me this is clearly an attempt to deceive the base runner(s) outside of the spirit of the rules, but coaches are using the fact that at 13 years old the kids aren't taking signs from the catcher as a loop hole. I don't have an issue with straddling the pitcher's plate prior to stepping into position if the pitcher is looking a runner back, attempting to make a play on him, or just collecting his thoughts, but once you start looking at the catcher, signs or not, I feel like the intent of the rule is being violated. This is something relatively new to me as this is the first year my son has played with runners being able to lead off of all bases, and I haven't seen this tactic in older age groups that I umpire.

Am I missing something here or should this be handled differently? I also realize the offense could put this to a halt by asking for Time making the ball dead until play is resumed which requires the pitcher to take his place on the pitcher's plate, but I think that would slow the game down significantly.

[Rich Ives]

Originally Posted by BoomerSooner

I've noticed in my son's baseball games that many pitchers have been taught to straddle the pitcher's plate until they are ready to pitch if there are runners on base. Based on watching what follows, my belief is that this is being done to help them manage runners taking a lead without the potential for a balk. When the pitcher decides he's going to pitch, he moves his pivot foot forward in contact with the pitcher's plate and then relatively quickly gets set and pitches. It isn't so quick that the batter isn't prepared, and thus I don't I think a quick pitch is warranted, so that isn't my issue. Where I'm bothered by this is that the pitchers that have been taught to do this will look at the catcher prior to contacting the plate and then wait for a runner to take a lead and then throw over to first or fake a throw hoping another runner will break for the next base. When I've asked why this is being allowed I've been told that there can't be a balk because the pitcher isn't touching his plate. When I asked about the requirement to take signs while in contact with the pitcher's plate, the response I get is that the catcher isn't giving signs so the pitcher isn't taking signs and that rule doesn't apply.

To me this is clearly an attempt to deceive the base runner(s) outside of the spirit of the rules, but coaches are using the fact that at 13 years old the kids aren't taking signs from the catcher as a loop hole. I don't have an issue with straddling the pitcher's plate prior to stepping into position if the pitcher is looking a runner back, attempting to make a play on him, or just collecting his thoughts, but once you start looking at the catcher, signs or not, I feel like the intent of the rule is being violated. This is something relatively new to me as this is the first year my son has played with runners being able to lead off of all bases, and I haven't seen this tactic in older age groups that I umpire.

Am I missing something here or should this be handled differently? I also realize the offense could put this to a halt by asking for Time making the ball dead until play is resumed which requires the pitcher to take his place on the pitcher's plate, but I think that would slow the game down significantly.

You are thinking way too much and inventing "should be" rules.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by BoomerSooner

I've noticed in my son's baseball games that many pitchers have been taught to straddle the pitcher's plate until they are ready to pitch if there are runners on base. Based on watching what follows, my belief is that this is being done to help them manage runners taking a lead without the potential for a balk. When the pitcher decides he's going to pitch, he moves his pivot foot forward in contact with the pitcher's plate and then relatively quickly gets set and pitches. It isn't so quick that the batter isn't prepared, and thus I don't I think a quick pitch is warranted, so that isn't my issue. Where I'm bothered by this is that the pitchers that have been taught to do this will look at the catcher prior to contacting the plate and then wait for a runner to take a lead and then throw over to first or fake a throw hoping another runner will break for the next base. When I've asked why this is being allowed I've been told that there can't be a balk because the pitcher isn't touching his plate. When I asked about the requirement to take signs while in contact with the pitcher's plate, the response I get is that the catcher isn't giving signs so the pitcher isn't taking signs and that rule doesn't apply.

To me this is clearly an attempt to deceive the base runner(s) outside of the spirit of the rules, but coaches are using the fact that at 13 years old the kids aren't taking signs from the catcher as a loop hole. I don't have an issue with straddling the pitcher's plate prior to stepping into position if the pitcher is looking a runner back, attempting to make a play on him, or just collecting his thoughts, but once you start looking at the catcher, signs or not, I feel like the intent of the rule is being violated. This is something relatively new to me as this is the first year my son has played with runners being able to lead off of all bases, and I haven't seen this tactic in older age groups that I umpire.

Am I missing something here or should this be handled differently? I also realize the offense could put this to a halt by asking for Time making the ball dead until play is resumed which requires the pitcher to take his place on the pitcher's plate, but I think that would slow the game down significantly.

The first and most important thing to remember is that the Pitching Rules do not take effect until F1 intentionally engages the Pitcher's Plate (PP).

Second: There is nothing against an act being deceptive as long as the act is not an infraction of the rules.

When F1 is straddling the PP he is not a Pitcher but an Infielder. (Think: one base from the PP and two bases from the Field.) While straddling the PP, F1 can take signs from anyone, but once he engages the PP he shall take (or simulate taking, this is a concept taken from FP Softball) his signs from F2. The requirement of F1 taking his signs from F2 while engaged with the PP is to prevent one thing and one thing only: Quick Pitch.

MTD, Sr.

[BoomerSooner]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

The first and most important thing to remember is that the Pitching Rules do not take effect until F1 intentionally engages the Pitcher's Plate (PP).

Second: There is nothing against an act being deceptive as long as the act is not an infraction of the rules.

When F1 is straddling the PP he is not a Pitcher but an Infielder. (Think: one base from the PP and two bases from the Field.) While straddling the PP, F1 can take signs from anyone, but once he engages the PP he shall take (or simulate taking, this is a concept taken from FP Softball) his signs from F2. The requirement of F1 taking his signs from F2 while engaged with the PP is to prevent one thing and one thing only: Quick Pitch.

MTD, Sr.

So to check my interpretation of what you are saying: Simulating taking signs from the catcher while not in contact with the PP is fine. Failing to take signs (or at least simulating them) and then quick pitching is the issue.

I had a feeling I was venturing into the realm of "should be" rules that Rich mentioned. The whole thing just feels wrong to me if for no other reason than it doesn't feel like a normal part of baseball.

I can say that my son did figure out that one of the opposing pitchers last night wasn't even going to attempt a pick off once he stepped on the PP. He initially came close to being picked off 1st base while taking a lead while the pitcher was not in contact with the PP. After that the pitcher went through the same routine but never even glanced at my son after stepping on the PP. On the next pitch, my son took off for second almost immediately after the pitcher stepped on the PP and was half way there when the pitcher started his motion toward home. I think the fact that these kids aren't being taught how to hold runners might be part of why I have a problem with this. This makes me thankful that I'm calling games in older ages where the pitchers have advanced beyond this. I appreciate the feedback.