Ball Played in Non Playable Area - Whose Call?

[bob jenkins]

B's first contact is shanked toward a non-playable area between the bench and the table. B2 gives chase, but B2's foot contacts the non-playable area before he can contact the ball.

Is this R2's Call (whistle, signal)?
Or, does R2 just give information to R1 who makes the call?
Or, is it R1's call?
Or, something else?

[Scrapper1]

I honestly don't know if there's a "correct" way, per the manual. But I've worked with R1s who have asked me to do different things. Some have said that it's their call (but they'll take help), and others have said "You're right there. You call it."

So in my experience, anyway, it's a pre-game conversation.

[FMadera]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

I honestly don't know if there's a "correct" way, per the manual. But I've worked with R1s who have asked me to do different things. Some have said that it's their call (but they'll take help), and others have said "You're right there. You call it."

So in my experience, anyway, it's a pre-game conversation.

I agree with this last sentence. It's "however the R1 ultimately decides to handle it in your pre-match."

Also, the "correct" answer is "it depends," as the original question, in and of itself, doesn't necessarily describe a fault.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by FMadera

as the original question, in and of itself, doesn't necessarily describe a fault.

Oooooo! Good catch. We all know what the question is asking, but the actual description doesn't give enough information to determine if contacting the ball would be a fault.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Oooooo! Good catch. We all know what the question is asking, but the actual description doesn't give enough information to determine if contacting the ball would be a fault.

That's on me. It was a fault (no foot in contact with a playable area)

And, I'll add it to the "items to discuss before the match" list

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

T

And, I'll add it to the "items to discuss before the match" list

What else should be on the "discuss before the match" list?

A) Leading four or trailing four?

B) Will R1 turn around to follow the ball (nearly) behind him or give that call to R2? (and vice versa)

C) How much help on ball handling?

D) How much help on rotations / alignment (if working with a newer partner)?

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

What else should be on the "discuss before the match" list?

A) Leading four or trailing four?

B) Will R1 turn around to follow the ball (nearly) behind him or give that call to R2? (and vice versa)

C) How much help on ball handling?

D) How much help on rotations / alignment (if working with a newer partner)?

This should probably be its own thread. If I'm R1, I want to address the following:

1) I want help on ballhandling that I can't see. If the player's back is to me, give me whatever you have.

2) R2 will whistle if ball is played from non-playable area between the benches.

3) R2 will take Libero's feet if overhand set is near the attack line.

4) R2 will help, if possible, with back-row attacker's feet.

5) I will take help on any illegal back-row attack/block at the net.

6) I don't care about whether help on 4s is leading or trailing. (Although I believe in NCAA, the leading 4 is not a correct mechanic.) But if you know that the ball only hit the tape, I definitely want a 4 signal.

7) I will take help if the ball is down on a pancake play.

8) I will take any help on touches at the net. (Probably don't really need to pre-game that one! )

9) If I need to talk to a line judge, both line judges and the R2 will come to the stand.

If I'm R2, I will want to ask the R1 if there's anything I need to know about the coaches.

[FMadera]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

This should probably be its own thread. If I'm R1, I want to address the following:

1) I want help on ballhandling that I can't see. If the player's back is to me, give me whatever you have.

2) R2 will whistle if ball is played from non-playable area between the benches.

3) R2 will take Libero's feet if overhand set is near the attack line.

4) R2 will help, if possible, with back-row attacker's feet.

5) I will take help on any illegal back-row attack/block at the net.

6) I don't care about whether help on 4s is leading or trailing. (Although I believe in NCAA, the leading 4 is not a correct mechanic.) But if you know that the ball only hit the tape, I definitely want a 4 signal.

7) I will take help if the ball is down on a pancake play.

8) I will take any help on touches at the net. (Probably don't really need to pre-game that one! )

9) If I need to talk to a line judge, both line judges and the R2 will come to the stand.

If I'm R2, I will want to ask the R1 if there's anything I need to know about the coaches.

These are but some examples. Also, there should be a discussion with the non-referees as well. Things like:

1) (Primary scorer) how do you want subs communicated to you?
2) (Primary scorer) what communication do you want from them to know they're ready? For example, I want their "ready," or your way of knowing they are ready to verify the server, to consist of the final thing they do during a sub to be to tell me how many subs that team has used. That way, I don't have to wait until they "remember" to inform me of subs.
3) (Assistant scorer) let them know how to let you know during a timeout if the libero is on the court
4) (Scoreboard operator) not to rush putting the points up, when to stop the clock and horn during a timeout (like what signal will you give to them to do it, and making sure they don't do it without your signal)
5) (Host management) Where they will be located in case you need them.
6 (Shaggers) are there kids doing it, or at least students? If kids, who's in charge of them, and where will they be if you need to address something. Even if they're students, laying expectations on what you need to make sure we don't have unnecessary interruptions or delays.
7) (Line judges) how to signal, how long, how to communicate challenging issues, etc.

It's hard to do all of this during a high school warmup, but easier to do in a college setting. All of this, and more, can help your match flow smoothly.

[bob jenkins]

Great stuff, thanks.

(Some won't apply to most HS matches in this area, but useful nonetheless)

[Scrapper1]

As R1, I tell my R2 there's no need to "ask" to come to the stand. If you have info that you think I need, just come.