Fan distracting players

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

If you consider it coaching

If your State Association does not recognize that person as a coach, you don't have the authority to make their comments "coaching".

In my state, that person is not allowed in the team area, nor on the field. That makes him a fan, not a coach, and not subject to coaching restrictions.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

If your State Association does not recognize that person as a coach, you don't have the authority to make their comments "coaching".

In my state, that person is not allowed in the team area, nor on the field. That makes him a fan, not a coach, and not subject to coaching restrictions.

Gotcha.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

If your State Association does not recognize that person as a coach, you don't have the authority to make their comments "coaching".

In my state, that person is not allowed in the team area, nor on the field. That makes him a fan, not a coach, and not subject to coaching restrictions.

And in mine they don't want any coaching going on from behind the catcher - from either team.

[EsqUmp]

• Each umpire has authority to order a player, coach or team member or associate to do or refrain from doing anything that affects the administering of the rules and enforcing the prescribed penalties.
• Each umpire has authority to rule on any point not specifically covered in the rules. Each umpire will use common sense, good judgment and thoughtful reasoning based on the spirit of fair play when making rulings.


The short answer is this: Do what you think is right for the particular situation. There are a million scenarios and thousands of umpires. Don't let things escalate, but don't stick your nose in where it doesn't belong either.

"Never" and "Always" umpires are afraid to use common sense, good judgment and thoughtful reasoning; so, they either always do something or never do something. Evaluate the situation and address is in a manner you find appropriate for your particular case.

[topper]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

And in mine they don't want any coaching going on from behind the catcher - from either team.

I work some HS in your state. Would that be TASO or UIL that is saying this? Please cite where fans are considered coaches.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by topper

I work some HS in your state. Would that be TASO or UIL that is saying this? Please cite where fans are considered coaches.

I don't know that I've ever attended (or even heard of) a UIL clinic...

It's come up at more than one TASO meeting - not really calling fans coaches per se, but more along the lines of not allowing coaching to occur from directly behind the catcher, and keeping that area (where possible) as a kind of "neutral zone" if you will.

I think one example given was a Yates - Stafford game - visiting JV coach camped right behind the catcher dressed out of uniform and was coaching the kids on where the catcher set up. Home fans then decided they would do the same, and it came to pushing and shoving.

You have to admit that the ability to give players instruction from right there behind the plate is an advantage - I completely understand the desire to prevent that.

[topper]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

I don't know that I've ever attended (or even heard of) a UIL clinic...

We were a UIL Chapter the last couple of years. While we were thankfully spared the monumental waste of time that is a TASO clinic, the softball board did communicate with us from time to time. I wasn't sure where the "no giving instructions from behind the backstop" came from.

As for the OP, where would you draw the line on what can be said from the stands? Would you consider "Watch out for the change-up", "Keep your head in there", etc. something to be stopped?

I'm not sure the rules prohibit a coach on the field from telling a batter where the catcher is set up, much less someone in the stands. If pushing and shoving happens in the stands, it is a site administrator issue, not an umpire issue.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by topper

As for the OP, where would you draw the line on what can be said from the stands? Would you consider "Watch out for the change-up", "Keep your head in there", etc. something to be stopped?

No, not at all.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

It's come up at more than one TASO meeting - not really calling fans coaches per se, but more along the lines of not allowing coaching to occur from directly behind the catcher, and keeping that area (where possible) as a kind of "neutral zone" if you will.

I think one example given was a Yates - Stafford game - visiting JV coach camped right behind the catcher dressed out of uniform and was coaching the kids on where the catcher set up. Home fans then decided they would do the same, and it came to pushing and shoving.

That's a different situation than the OP. If it can be proven that a "real" coach is behind the backstop, that is certainly an issue to be dealt with using the rule book.

But if it's just a fan, I agree that the best way to deal with it is to get the school's athletic director or other rep to handle it. I think it's inappropriate to consider it "coaching" and try to deal with it that way.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Manny A

But if it's just a fan, I agree that the best way to deal with it is to get the school's athletic director or other rep to handle it. I think it's inappropriate to consider it "coaching" and try to deal with it that way.

Manny:

If you already know that it is just a fan doing the shouting, why are you even bothering to get game management involved. It is a fan, let them shout all they want. There is no rule justification for you or game management to get involved.

MTD, Sr.

[Tru_in_Blu]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Manny:

If you already know that it is just a fan doing the shouting, why are you even bothering to get game management involved. It is a fan, let them shout all they want. There is no rule justification for you or game management to get involved.

MTD, Sr.

While there may be no specific rule in our book(s), we've been given the following mandate from the New Hampshire Interscholastic A.A.

"The National High School Federation and your state association require officials to enforce sportsmanship rules. High school athletics emphasize positive values. All of us have worked hard to create a sense of teamwork, respect, responsibility and perspective. We remind you that we expect good behavior and will quickly penalize misconduct. We encourage and appreciate your help. Let this competition reflect mutual respect among all participants and officials. Coaches please certify that your players are legally equipped and uniformed according to NFHS rules."

While the above gives officials no specific responsibilities as to what goes on outside the confines of the field, sportsmanship relating to the game can be addressed by either the coach(es) and/or game managers.

I believe in most cases, simply asking an offending party to cease doing what he/she is doing will suffice. Certainly, the rare exception will occur but in 5 years that I've been working HS ball, I haven't seen it. Hope it stays that way.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Manny:

If you already know that it is just a fan doing the shouting, why are you even bothering to get game management involved. It is a fan, let them shout all they want. There is no rule justification for you or game management to get involved.

MTD, Sr.

I would get them involved if what's happening outside the fence affects what's happening inside. Why ignore it and let it potentially cause problems involving the coaches and players?

99% of the stuff I hear from the bleachers, I ignore completely. It's that 1% that I feel is going to escalate where I ask the person responsible for keeping fans in check to take care of it if he/she hasn't already gotten involved.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

I don't know that I've ever attended (or even heard of) a UIL clinic...

No. You won't. However, it is the UIL, and not TASO or LHSSOA who decide how rules are to be applied in this state. The official's organizations are merely the mouthpieces.

[Skahtboi]

In the OP, this would strictly be a game administrator's issue, IMO. That is why, at least in this state, they are required to be present for every varsity match and recommended for all sub-varsity games.