Lineup Card SNAFU

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by shagpal

seven does sound like eleven. maybe you were thinking of a big gulp.

Yeah, after the explanation, the coach kept repeating, "Seven eleven. Seven eleven," as if to either remind herself that they sound alike, or to subtly chastise me for not understanding the difference.

Candidly, she could've been the one who made the mistake, and actually said "Ten for Eleven". It's possible she first wanted to replace 11, but then changed her mind as she approached me, only to verbalize her original intent. Who knows?

I should've repeated back to her the way I normally announce changes to coaches and scorers. I verbalize "11" as "One-One," not "eleven." For some reason, I didn't do this with her, and it came back to bite me. Oh well, lesson definitely learned...

[teebob21]

SNAFU? If that's Situation Normal, Manny, you have my sympathies. I kid, I kid....

It certainly was FUBAR, though. Glad I haven't had anything like that happen to me. I usually use the name suggestion above for subs; "11 Molly in for 10 Mary, Coach?"

[Steve M]

I'll usually only use the numbers, but I will have the coach watch me make the change and then look at the lineup card and verify the change before we part.

[CVLLBlue]

Originally Posted by Manny A

Yeah, after the explanation, the coach kept repeating, "Seven eleven. Seven eleven," as if to either remind herself that they sound alike, or to subtly chastise me for not understanding the difference.

Candidly, she could've been the one who made the mistake, and actually said "Ten for Eleven". It's possible she first wanted to replace 11, but then changed her mind as she approached me, only to verbalize her original intent. Who knows?

I should've repeated back to her the way I normally announce changes to coaches and scorers. I verbalize "11" as "One-One," not "eleven." For some reason, I didn't do this with her, and it came back to bite me. Oh well, lesson definitely learned...

Manny,
I had a similar situation in a District LL tournament game. The Home Team Manager came to and made a change that I repeated back to him in the bottom of the 4th inning.
Top of the 6th inning ended with the player not receiving their 1 at bat and even though the HT was winning 8-2 and were celebrating the win, the VT Coach came out and asked for a protest that the player was in violation of not having his 1 at bat.
I went to the TD and informed him of the protest, (no need to go to my partners since the were not involved in the change).
Since this was back in the day when this type of violation of LL's Mandatory Play rule was a forfeit, it went quickly to District, to Region, to Williamsport who upheld the forfeit as my line up is the official one.
The HT Manager and Coaches were screaming at me during the process and all I said to them was that I repeated their change back to them so why was I the one who misunderstood.
Manny, I am sure you have successfully made hundreds, if not thousands of changes over the years you have umpired. Don't beat yourself up over this. You did what you were told to do, plain and simple.
The only change I have made in my method of making changes is to have the manager making the change on defense, make them with me by the scorekeeper and have them confirm back to both of us the change. It is obvious on offensive changes because LL requires them to be made at the time of the at bat, so there is virtually no chance of a wrong change.

[shagpal]

oh thank heaven, for 7/11! maybe she wanted a big gulp.

it's really on her once you acknowledge back, but if you have her stay with you and watch while you make the changes on the lineup card, what can she say? that she didn't hear OR see the changes acknowledged back? sometimes I'll even show the lineup card and ask, "that the way you want it"?

Originally Posted by Manny A

Yeah, after the explanation, the coach kept repeating, "Seven eleven. Seven eleven," as if to either remind herself that they sound alike, or to subtly chastise me for not understanding the difference.

Candidly, she could've been the one who made the mistake, and actually said "Ten for Eleven". It's possible she first wanted to replace 11, but then changed her mind as she approached me, only to verbalize her original intent. Who knows?

I should've repeated back to her the way I normally announce changes to coaches and scorers. I verbalize "11" as "One-One," not "eleven." For some reason, I didn't do this with her, and it came back to bite me. Oh well, lesson definitely learned...

[EsqUmp]

Due to problems I've seen in other games (this is a good example) I make the coach stand next to me as I write it down and confirm that it is what they want. I always use names and numbers, especially because it is the name, NOT the number that dictates the change.

While there are no guarantees, these small things go a long way to prevent problems.

[IRISHMAFIA]

You can talk to the coach, repeat the change, ask him/her to stay there and watch, but you cannot control the coach's mind or attention if they are not willing to partake.

You can only listen, record, repeat and present the information. You cannot force them to partake if they don't want to be bothered.

[txtrooper]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

You can talk to the coach, repeat the change, ask him/her to stay there and watch, but you cannot control the coach's mind or attention if they are not willing to partake.

You can only listen, record, repeat and present the information. You cannot force them to partake if they don't want to be bothered.

Agreed!