Anyone familiar with LL softball rules?

[RKBUmp]

Watching LL softball on tv this morning. Seeing tons of obstructions not called and just saw an illegal pitch called with runners on 2 and 3 and all the did was give the batter a ball.

Anyone have the obstruction wording from the LL rule book, and what the penalty for an IP is?

[CecilOne]

Best I can do on short notice:

https://www.facebook.com/LittleLeagueSoftball

[HugoTafurst]

Originally Posted by RKBUmp

Watching LL softball on tv this morning. Seeing tons of obstructions not called and just saw an illegal pitch called with runners on 2 and 3 and all the did was give the batter a ball.

Anyone have the obstruction wording from the LL rule book, and what the penalty for an IP is?

I saw some obstruction I thought should be called also, but that's a judgments call. A fielder without possession of the ball may not obstruct.
They also have it divided into type A (if a play is being made on the runner) and type B (when a play is not being made on a runner).
Simplifying with type A (such as F6 blocking second base on a steal - which is one I thought I saw), the runner is awarded a base. Type B the runner is given the base she would have achieved if there had been no obstruction. This differs from what you may be used to in that there is no automatic protection between the bases where the obstruction occurred.

On an illegal pitch, no bases are awarded, only a ball is awarded to the batter.

[RKBUmp]

I cant find the entire rule book, but did find some blurbs about illegal pitches that indicated it was just a ball.

I saw a couple of obvious obstructions in the big league game, the one was F3 standing directly in the basepath between 1st and 2nd forcing the batter/runner way wide on a hit into center field. It actually turned into a fairly close play at 2nd.

[ASA/NYSSOBLUE]

I do not mean to denigrate, but: Has anyone ever seen any real talent in that game? I know i tried watching it a couple of years ago, and coming away very unimpressed. It looked liked a low level JV game.

The one thing I bet ESPN/ABC never mention is that just about any decent 17 yr old softball player is spending her summer playing in college showcases, if not getting ready to go to college somewhere. And how exactly does a team get to host a national title game that it is in

Again, I know the kids all play hard, and the parents put so much into it also, but I have, and will always say that there very few bigger jokes in sports than Little League Softball. And the only reason its on TV is because Little League MAKES them put it on as part of the deal for the LLWS.

[outathm]

The lead off hitter for the Delaware Big league team is going to Virginia Tech on a scholarship next year.

[RKBUmp]

For the most part any LL softball game I have seen on TV the past 3-4 years is far below the level of competition I see in club ball tournaments. Yes, the one girl for Delaware they did make a point of saying she would be playing for Virginia Tech next year, but that was 1 girl out of 12 or 13 on the team? Im sure the championship teams at both ASA and Premier virtually every girl has long since signed with a college.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by ASA/NYSSOBLUE

I do not mean to denigrate, but: Has anyone ever seen any real talent in that game? I know i tried watching it a couple of years ago, and coming away very unimpressed. It looked liked a low level JV game.

The one thing I bet ESPN/ABC never mention is that just about any decent 17 yr old softball player is spending her summer playing in college showcases, if not getting ready to go to college somewhere. And how exactly does a team get to host a national title game that it is in

Again, I know the kids all play hard, and the parents put so much into it also, but I have, and will always say that there very few bigger jokes in sports than Little League Softball. And the only reason its on TV is because Little League MAKES them put it on as part of the deal for the LLWS.

Don't kid yourself, many of these teams are stacked.

LL format is basically the same as what the ASA "B" program is SUPPOSED to be, league teams or all-star teams from the same league. IOW, not travel ball teams with no geographical boundaries. Those involved in ASA know there are many commissioners which sort of run these programs under parameters not exactly the same as noted in the code.

You shouldn't discount the point that in spite of how LL has tried to control it, there are players in LL championships that play ASA and other travel ball, some may even just be coming out of the nationals.

[Manny A]

Unfortunately, LL Softball has historically been nothing more than LL Baseball being played by girls with a larger ball. This trend has been slowly changing recently, since LL HQ is trying to attract more players to play the game. But there are still a number of softball rules and umpiring mechanics that come from the baseball side of the house that LL HQ haven't changed.

As Hugo mentioned, LL Softball has the same obstruction rules--Type A and Type B--that you find in baseball. They still consider catcher obstruction as catcher interference. They don't protect runners who get hit with batted balls while on bases. They don't recognize dead ball appeals. They don't allow courtesy runners, but do allow special pinch runners. Pitcher's visits are tracked the same as in baseball. And, Yes, they still allow legal fields to have grass infields.

Umpiring LL Softball is also a challenge if you're trained as an ASA or NFHS softball umpire. Plate umpires must track pitches only with the eyes, and cannot move their heads. There is no distinguishing delayed-dead ball signal; when an umpire sees a violation that gets enforced after the play ends, such as illegal pitches or Type B obstruction, the umpire simply points at the infraction while verbalizing the call. Umpires cannot call "DEAD BALL!" to kill play. And the PU is rarely responsible for plays at third under two-man. From a mechanics standpoint, a LL Baseball umpire would be better-suited to call a LL Softball game than an ASA umpire.

[HugoTafurst]

Originally Posted by Manny A

(Snip) Umpires cannot call "DEAD BALL!" to kill play.
(snip.

Well, an umpire CAN call "DEAD BALL" but he/she faces a world of imature ridicule if he/she does....

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Manny A

They don't allow courtesy runners, but do allow special pinch runners.

I would really like to understand the differences. Thanks in advance.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

I would really like to understand the differences. Thanks in advance.

Two huge differences. ANY player can be pinch run for (not just pitchers and catchers), and each individual player can only be pinch run for once in a game.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

I would really like to understand the differences. Thanks in advance.

I assume you understand how to use courtesy runners in softball, so I won't belabor that one.

In LL (both baseball and softball), special pinch runners are similar to courtesy runners in that a runner is replaced by a player not in the lineup. But the similarity ends there.

SPRs may be used for any player, not just the pitcher and catcher. And they may only be used once per inning. Also, a certain player may only be removed for an SPR once in the game.

There is also no restriction for entering the kid who SPR'ed as a real substitute later in the inning, nor is there a restriction for putting in a kid to SPR who was removed for a sub in the inning. And unlike CRs, a kid who was in the game earlier can still serve as an SPR after being removed from the lineup.