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  #31 (permalink)  
Old Mon Aug 05, 2013, 04:26pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
As far as umpires at the GOLD knowing the expectations, I was told that three of the 40 umpires at my tournament in 2011 had never worked a three-umpire game in their life. If that is the case, that needs to fall back on the local UIC that recommended these umpires for the tournament.
Andy, that could be part of the problem. It isn't always the UIC who makes the nominations, right Steve?

In some cases, it is commissioners, district commissioners, etc. When I did the 16's, I talked to the host state UIC and he had no input on the umpires. Knew who they were, but not necessarily if they were qualified.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old Mon Aug 05, 2013, 04:54pm
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Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA View Post
Andy, that could be part of the problem. It isn't always the UIC who makes the nominations, right Steve?

In some cases, it is commissioners, district commissioners, etc. When I did the 16's, I talked to the host state UIC and he had no input on the umpires. Knew who they were, but not necessarily if they were qualified.
Sure is. But, I can only speak about what happens locally - not with any authority, just what I've experienced.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old Mon Aug 05, 2013, 10:36pm
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Originally Posted by Manny A View Post
Just a few observations from my time spent working the 18U Gold in Clearwater. Overall, everything was pretty much by the ASA Umpire Manual, as expected. There were some things I learned that the Manual doesn’t cover, or if it does, I didn’t really know about it until I got dinged during my evals. Hope these help some of you in your three-man ASA tourneys.

1. The Safe mechanic when you judge a violation did not happen is not an approved mechanic. For example, a runner barely avoids being hit by a batted ball. We are not to give a Safe sign to let everyone know there was no violation.

2. The Timing Play signal (two fingers to the wrist) is not an approved mechanic. Neither is the sweep motion to signal a fielder came off the bag too soon on a force play.

3. Signaling all foul balls, even obvious ones, is expected. However, there is no verbal required on those obvious ones.

4. Helping the PU on swinging third strikes near the ground (fist for a catch, pointing down for a no catch) is not an approved mechanic. The BU who sees a catch may nod if the PU looks for help.

5. If U1 chases with no runners on base, U3 is responsible for any plays on the BR at first. U3 has to hightail it across the diamond to take responsibility. Even though the PU trails, the PU does not take the call at first.

6. U1 and U3 are not to go into foul territory to make calls at their bases. For example, no runners and the batter hits a sharp grounder to F9. F9 throws to first to play on the BR. U1 either button-hooks in to take the call (preferred option), or takes a step into fair territory to make it.

7. Foul pop-ups between home plate and the BU positions are not to be bracketed. For example, batter pops up a foul toward the first base dugout that both F2 and F3 move to make the play. U1 is NOT supposed to move toward the fence to help the PU watch the play.

8. When the ball is back in the circle after play ends, the umpire at the plate (PU normally, or U1 if the crew performed a full rotation) shall always call Time so that the crew can quickly get into their positions for the next pitch. Do not waste time by moving individually into position while partners watch runners.

9. There are no holding zones when nobody chases. After the PU trails the BR on a hit to the outfield, the PU should move directly to third base in fair territory, and U1 should move directly behind home plate, after the BR commits to second. The same is true when R1 reaches second on a batted ball.

10. The on-deck circle must be ruthlessly enforced. Between innings, only the lead-off batter may be out of the dugout, and she must be in the circle. Also ruthlessly enforce the one-foot-in-the-box rule on batters.

As for uniformity on old and new logos, there were no problems with it. Crews mixed and matched logos often, and in some cases, one umpire would mix (e.g., old shirt with new hat).

If I remember anything else that’s peculiar, I’ll mention it.
just a FYI, every one of these were brought up and instructed at the 2012 Advanced camp. (but there are some who think 'paying $400 to learn the prescribed mechanic and then get paid to work a dozen or so games to 'learn to button hook' is a waste of time and money)

Like I mentioned to a fellow blue this weekend at a USA-ASA National, 'it was the best $400 I have spent'

I'll go back in couple of years too! In a sense, you 'got' an advance camp in Clearwater as well.

Last edited by okla21fan; Mon Aug 05, 2013 at 10:39pm.
  #34 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 06, 2013, 12:05am
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#5 is the chute play, and $400 to learn how it is different from NCAA, or pay $20 for the NCAA umpires manual to understand both.

Quote:
Originally Posted by okla21fan View Post
just a FYI, every one of these were brought up and instructed at the 2012 Advanced camp. (but there are some who think 'paying $400 to learn the prescribed mechanic and then get paid to work a dozen or so games to 'learn to button hook' is a waste of time and money)

Like I mentioned to a fellow blue this weekend at a USA-ASA National, 'it was the best $400 I have spent'

I'll go back in couple of years too! In a sense, you 'got' an advance camp in Clearwater as well.
  #35 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 06, 2013, 07:16am
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Originally Posted by shagpal View Post
#5 is the chute play, and $400 to learn how it is different from NCAA, or pay $20 for the NCAA umpires manual to understand both.
You keep on coming up with real winners. One of these days you might look into some things and actually try to learn WTF you are talking about.
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 06, 2013, 07:32am
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Quote:

5. If U1 chases with no runners on base, U3 is responsible for any plays on the BR at first. U3 has to hightail it across the diamond to take responsibility. Even though the PU trails, the PU does not take the call at first.
Speaking of #5, y'all talk like it is a mile for U3 to get into this position when it isn't that big a deal. It is a 60' diamond. U3 shouldn't be, but about 100' from 1B and moving closer the second s/he realizes the ball isn't hit to F5.

Based on what I would consider reasonable cause to go out, not just out on anything not on the dirt, the odds of a play @ 1B with U1 in the OF should be quite rare and should there be one, U3 will have a better angle than the PU on a throw coming from that part of the field.

IOW, big freaking deal! Any umpire who cannot cover that distance in a reasonable time with ordinary effort probably needs to start working on his/her golf game.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 06, 2013, 09:23am
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What is "the chute play"?
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 06, 2013, 09:28am
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Originally Posted by tcannizzo View Post
What is "the chute play"?
Aw Chute! Now I havta get mah slow butt all the way acrawss tha dimond.
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 06, 2013, 12:10pm
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Originally Posted by MD Longhorn View Post
Aw Chute! Now I havta get mah slow butt all the way acrawss tha dimond.
Love that Texas drawl
  #40 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 13, 2013, 01:55am
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#5

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Originally Posted by tcannizzo View Post
what is "the chute play"?
  #41 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 13, 2013, 07:48am
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Originally Posted by shagpal View Post
#5
So, this must be a chute post...
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 13, 2013, 12:48pm
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That'd be the "aw, shucks", I fergot I gotta attend an advanced camp post.

#5 as described is nicknamed such for the infamous ASA "chute" play. That is why they call U3 the "rabbit". When you see race horses or race dogs at the track, rodeo, iditarod, whatever, the animals come firing outa their chutes at the starting gate and move like bat outa hell.

In ASA, U3 has to "shoot" outa the chute to cover the BR on said #5 chute play when U1 chases with no runners on. In NCAA, PU takes that BR because PU is already trailing. This play is a 3-man mechanics play, something apparently taught at so called advance camp.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tcannizzo View Post
So, this must be a chute post...
  #43 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 13, 2013, 12:51pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shagpal View Post
That'd be the "aw, shucks", I fergot I gotta attend an advanced camp post.

#5 as described is nicknamed such for the infamous ASA "chute" play. That is why they call U3 the "rabbit". When you see race horses or race dogs at the track, rodeo, iditarod, whatever, the animals come firing outa their chutes at the starting gate and move like bat outa hell.

In ASA, U3 has to "shoot" outa the chute to cover the BR on said #5 chute play when U1 chases with no runners on. In NCAA, PU takes that BR because PU is already trailing. This play is a 3-man mechanics play, something apparently taught at so called advance camp.
What's all this advance camp nonsense?

This is BASIC 3-man in ASA. One of perhaps 5 sentences I would give a newbie thrust into 3-man with no notice for the very first time.
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 13, 2013, 01:02pm
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Originally Posted by shagpal View Post
In ASA, U3 has to "shoot" outa the chute to cover the BR on said #5 chute play when U1 chases with no runners on. .
In non-NCAA softball, U3 has to cover the BR when U1 chases with no runners on.
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  #45 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 13, 2013, 01:02pm
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He asked, I answered.

It has been asked more than once. No one else wanted to answer. That is nonsense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MD Longhorn View Post
What's all this advance camp nonsense?

This is BASIC 3-man in ASA. One of perhaps 5 sentences I would give a newbie thrust into 3-man with no notice for the very first time.
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