outside protector

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

1) Tournament Directors here in the Toledo Area do NOT want games starting after their scheduled time: Games WILL start on time! You do not know how often coaches complain because we have started the game 5 minutes, , late because we have taken an extra 5 minutes to rest between games.
MTD, Sr.

You know what, Mark? Tough. If THEY are dumb enough to schedule games that close, that is their issue. An umpire should never be pushed to any point of not being properly equipped or not getting a chance to catch their breath. IMO, too many umpires play into this crap and shame on the UICs that allow it.

Yes, we all want to be on time. If a coach bitches, remind him of all the time s/he and his team waste on rah-rah or "huddles". I've seen TDs hold a tournament up because the poor players had to play back-to-back because they fell to the loser's bracket early. Let me see, who gets to take a break at least every half-inning, usually in the shade and with cold water available whenever. But the umpires are expected to be perfect on the field and immortal all the time?

AFA the topic, I started umpiring with the balloon in 66 and loved it. The new ones are way too small, but the original offered much more protection than the inside protectors. If you can get one, use it.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

...2a) Plate Gear is more than a Chest Protector; it is also Shin Guards and Plate Shoes, as well as a Mask and a Breathing Apparatus (10 bonus points and a Cuban cigar for all who know what a Breathing Apparatus is, )....

You shouldn't forget, Mark, that some of us have been around this forum almost as long as you!

Cups

Now, about that Cuban cigar....

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Andy

You can get all of the opinions you want here, but the only thing that really matters is your assignor there in FL. If s/he is OK with it, go for it.

We have a HS SB umpire here in AZ that uses the outside protector. He is an older gentleman that wants to stay in the game, but had a colostomy several years ago. He does not feel adequately protected with an inside protector, so he asked permission to use the balloon and the state association agreed.

Why would he need the State Association's permission to use a balloon rather than an inside protector? Neither the OhioHSAA nor the MichiganHSAA require a baseball or softball umpire to use the inside protector.

MTD, Sr.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

You know what, Mark? Tough. If THEY are dumb enough to schedule games that close, that is their issue. An umpire should never be pushed to any point of not being properly equipped or not getting a chance to catch their breath. IMO, too many umpires play into this crap and shame on the UICs that allow it.

Yes, we all want to be on time. If a coach bitches, remind him of all the time s/he and his team waste on rah-rah or "huddles". I've seen TDs hold a tournament up because the poor players had to play back-to-back because they fell to the loser's bracket early. Let me see, who gets to take a break at least every half-inning, usually in the shade and with cold water available whenever. But the umpires are expected to be perfect on the field and immortal all the time?

AFA the topic, I started umpiring with the balloon in 66 and loved it. The new ones are way too small, but the original offered much more protection than the inside protectors. If you can get one, use it.

Irish:

You are preaching to the choir. Every time I have mentioned using a three-umpire rotation, you would not believe how many umpires protest. They do not want to be on site for as many as 9 games in order to umpire 6 games. They want to work 6 games in a row so they can get down quicker even if it "kills" them.

MTD, Sr

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Irish:

You are preaching to the choir. Every time I have mentioned using a three-umpire rotation, you would not believe how many umpires protest. They do not want to be on site for as many as 9 games in order to umpire 6 games. They want to work 6 games in a row so they can get down quicker even if it "kills" them.

MTD, Sr

There's no way in hell I'd stick around for 9 games and only get paid for 6 of them.

Easiest way to get on my scratch list is when a team forfeits in the middle of a string of games and the TD doesn't want to pay the umpires for that game, thinking that they'll just pocket that extra money.

[Tru_in_Blu]

I wouldn't even want to work 6 games in a day. I enjoy the 3-ump rotation. Three games is an ideal workload for me, but I've done 4 in a pinch.

Tired, cranky umpires are not what the teams are paying for.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Rich

There's no way in hell I'd stick around for 9 games and only get paid for 6 of them.

Easiest way to get on my scratch list is when a team forfeits in the middle of a string of games and the TD doesn't want to pay the umpires for that game, thinking that they'll just pocket that extra money.

Rich:

If I were a coach (and I have no desire to go over to the Dark Side) and I had my choice between an umpire who was umpiring his sixth game in a row as opposed to an umpire who was umpiring his sixth game of the day but was in a three umpire rotation where each umpire did not umpire more that two games in a row, I would definitely choose the latter. And as an umpire I would choose to be the latter umpire too.

MTD, Sr.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Rich:

If I were a coach (and I have no desire to go over to the Dark Side) and I had my choice between an umpire who was umpiring his sixth game in a row as opposed to an umpire who was umpiring his sixth game of the day but was in a three umpire rotation where each umpire did not umpire more that two games in a row, I would definitely choose the latter. And as an umpire I would choose to be the latter umpire too.

MTD, Sr.

I couldn't possibly care what the coaches want.

I do two or three of these marathon days a year, usually before I go on vacation. On those days, I'm there for the money, nothing more. In June I did 7 straight baseball games -- the first 4 on the plate. I was there to make $350 to take with me on vacation. And I'm arrogant enough to note that even in my fourth plate, I'm still better than 90% of the people they get working their first plate.

If they want me to sit a game, they'll have to pay me for it. Otherwise, I'm sure there are other umpires willing to work. (Actually, I'm not so sure, because by the time I agree to do it, they're usually saying that there's nobody else -- could I please do it?).

With the exception of those 2-3 days a year when I whore myself out, I don't work anything but single games and doubleheaders.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Rich

There's no way in hell I'd stick around for 9 games and only get paid for 6 of them.

Frankly, that's nuts. Plate-Base-Break-repeat is quite common, all over.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Frankly, that's nuts. Plate-Base-Break-repeat is quite common, all over.

Where you live, perhaps. Where I live, we work and then we go home.

Maybe the softball folks do it differently here. Not part of my frame of reference. I'll ask a couple and report back.

With softball games being so short, I guess I don't see the problem with working 3-4 in a row. Seems like a short day to this baseball guy.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Rich

I couldn't possibly care what the coaches want.

I do two or three of these marathon days a year, usually before I go on vacation. On those days, I'm there for the money, nothing more. In June I did 7 straight baseball games -- the first 4 on the plate. I was there to make $350 to take with me on vacation. And I'm arrogant enough to note that even in my fourth plate, I'm still better than 90% of the people they get working their first plate.

If they want me to sit a game, they'll have to pay me for it. Otherwise, I'm sure there are other umpires willing to work. (Actually, I'm not so sure, because by the time I agree to do it, they're usually saying that there's nobody else -- could I please do it?).

With the exception of those 2-3 days a year when I whore myself out, I don't work anything but single games and doubleheaders.

Rich:

It is nice to know that you don't care about your physical and mental condition at the end of the day, just so you can make a bucket load of money in one day.

MTD, Sr.

[Dakota]

Actually, Rich's view is rampant around here.

Not so much the "whoring" himself out part, but the unwillingness to sit. It seems getting umpires assigned to tournaments has a lot of dealing with whiny umpires and their "special" needs... can't work before noon, must be done by noon, want to do 4 and out, short of money, so want to work 7 in a row, yadda, yadda.

You couldn't PAY me enough to be an assignor and have to deal with this crap. Too much babysitting and appeasing of umpires than I have the patience for.

I don't know Rich, but I don't know anyone who is better after 4 games than 90% of the other umpires on their first game. He must be working with some set of crappy umpires.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Rich:

It is nice to know that you don't care about your physical and mental condition at the end of the day, just so you can make a bucket load of money in one day.

MTD, Sr.

Physically, I was quite fine. A bit sore the next day, but nothing that didn't go away in due time.

Mentally, I was tired at the end of the day. It's hard to focus for that long.

But I'm not kidding myself. My father worked in a steel mill for 30 years. Umpiring for 12-14 hours compared with that is child's play.

(And we did get breaks -- the games were scheduled 2:15 apart and when you turn in 4 plate jobs all less than 1:38, you get some time to relax. It was strange putting on the plate gear at 7:30AM and removing it almost 8 hours later, though.

The odd thing? I didn't hear a word from anyone in 7 games and only had one coach visit to ask about a rule that he didn't understand.)

I only did one day like that this year. Won't be any more. I'll work another 8-10 baseball games and then it will be football season for me.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Dakota

Actually, Rich's view is rampant around here.

Not so much the "whoring" himself out part, but the unwillingness to sit. It seems getting umpires assigned to tournaments has a lot of dealing with whiny umpires and their "special" needs... can't work before noon, must be done by noon, want to do 4 and out, short of money, so want to work 7 in a row, yadda, yadda.

You couldn't PAY me enough to be an assignor and have to deal with this crap. Too much babysitting and appeasing of umpires than I have the patience for.

I don't know Rick, but I don't know anyone who is better after 4 games than 90% of the other umpires on their first game. He must be working with some set of crappy umpires.

I'm sorry I'm going down this path -- one more post, I promise. I don't even work softball, so it's probably just a bit different for you folks.

Most top-notch college/HS baseball umpires don't touch that crap around here. So you end up with guys who are not very good on their best day. Calling balls and strikes at the youth level isn't exactly heavy lifting if you have good timing and call a good, aggressive zone.

Hey, I'm the one who's the independent contractor. Either I work the way I want to work OR I shrug and spend the day with my family. I don't *need* the money (it's nice to have on vacation, but a day at my day job pays more than even the longest day of umpiring could) -- they need me more. So either they use me the way I want OR they have more slots to fill. Supply and demand and all that.

We have leagues where they'll call at 11AM and say that the field won't be ready (usually because they don't show up at the field before 11AM to check the condition) for the 1PM start -- they're moving the game back to 2 or 3PM. I take 1PM games so I can have dinner with my family on Sundays. When they move the start time, I always tell them I can't do it and to find someone else.

I hear a lot of people complain about assignors and all the power they have in the assignor / umpire relationship. That's simply not true. It's because the umpire allows the assignor to have that power. But you have to be willing to not work once in a while....

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Rich

(And we did get breaks -- the games were scheduled 2:15 apart and when you turn in 4 plate jobs all less than 1:38, you get some time to relax. It was strange putting on the plate gear at 7:30AM and removing it almost 8 hours later, though.

I suppose if things were spaced out such that we had 30-45 minutes between games, scheduling several back to back wouldn't be as much of an issue.

Space them 10 minutes apart, and you might change your mind.
Work them in Texas, when it's 100 heat index on a good day, and you might change your mind.