Correct Call

[chapmaja]

I heard about this one from a friend of mine. He was on the defensive team that things they got screwed on the call.
ASA rules, adult SP

1 out, bottom of the 7th, tie ball game. Fly ball deep center field. LC fielder makes a running attempt at the catch, and as he makes contact with the glove on the ball he hits the wall. The runners on 2nd base takes off when contact is made between the ball and glove. The RC fielder runs over, makes a diving catch of the deflected ball which did not hit anything but the LCF's glove. The runner from second scores easily. The defense appeals the runner left early. Appeal denied. Two players ejected for arguing the call. This was the second call they feel the umpire blew on tag ups that game. The other was a line drive back at the pitcher which hit his glove and pops straight up in the air. Runner from third takes off as soon as the ball hits the glove of the pitcher. Runner from 3rd beats the throw home, the defense then appeals, again appeal denied.

I explained in both cases the runner is required to be on the base, or return to touch the base after the ball is contacted by a defensive player, not when it is caught. Since in both plays the ball was contacted by the defensive player, the runner was released from the base.

Was I, and the umpire correct?

[RKBUmp]

Runners are released when the ball is first contacted by the defense, not when the ball is actually caught.

[UmpireErnie]

So many SP games are done one man now.. and it's often very hard to get a good look at the tag up without compromising the call of catch/no catch.

Fly ball down 3B line with runner tagging at 1B. Not enough time to move from behind HP to a spot where you can have the runner at 1B in field of vision of catch and besides it's near the foul line.mmIf you glance back at the runner after the ball hits the fielders glove, now glance back and the ball is on the ground.. was it a catch? Did the fielder simply lose it on the transfer?

Priorities.. fair/foul, then catch/no catch, then (and only then) runner tag ups. Or sure I will take a glance while the ball is still on the fly to see if the runner is holding or is off with the hit. But once it comes down I am staying with the catch until I have an out.

I am simply saying that this appeal may have been denied because blue was busy watching what sounds like an amazing play in the outfield and has no clue if the runner left early. "Safe! Didn't see the runner leave first!" was what one old ASA training tape on one man mechanics taught.. it's hard to argue with that.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by UmpireErnie

Fly ball down 3B line with runner tagging at 1B. Not enough time to move from behind HP to a spot where you can have the runner at 1B in field of vision of catch and besides it's near the foul line.

I don't see this as a real problem if you simply move back to third-baseline extended and open up your field of vision. You will be able to see the runner at first peripherally while focused on the catch. Sure, it might put you a little further away for a potential tag play at second should R1 try to advance. But you can still get a good angle on the play.

I had a BU partner insist he should take the tag-up of R1 at third and I would take R2 at first on a fly ball down the right field line. I told him I could handle R1 by backing up along first-baseline extended. I don't see any advantage gained by moving up and straddling the line.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Manny A

I don't see this as a real problem if you simply move back to third-baseline extended and open up your field of vision. You will be able to see the runner at first peripherally while focused on the catch. Sure, it might put you a little further away for a potential tag play at second should R1 try to advance. But you can still get a good angle on the play.

That would work, but I'd rather be in a position to make a good call @ 2B.

Come up 3B line, open up toward fair territory so you can get 1B area in your peripheral range and turn your head to watch fair/foul & touch. On touch, turn head slightly to get a quick glace toward 1B and then back to the ball while moving toward middle of field for a possible call.

In all systems, there is always the possibility of sacrifice base upon priorities. In this instance, 1B is not unimportant, but near the bottom of the list in priorities.

I had a BU partner insist he should take the tag-up of R1 at third and I would take R2 at first on a fly ball down the right field line. I told him I could handle R1 by backing up along first-baseline extended. I don't see any advantage gained by moving up and straddling the line.

I agree with your partner.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Quote:Originally Posted by Manny A
I had a BU partner insist he should take the tag-up of R1 at third and I would take R2 at first on a fly ball down the right field line. I told him I could handle R1 by backing up along first-baseline extended. I don't see any advantage gained by moving up and straddling the line.



I agree with your partner.

BUT, needs to be discussed in pregame, possibly with a verbal "signal";
in which I avoid anything that tips off the players.