Retouch home after leaving field

[Insane Blue]

Originally Posted by DUNDALKCHOPPER

ASA- Is it legal to retouch home after leaving the field. If no, how should Ump handle. Let it happen and see if defense appeals it, or call runner out as soon as she reenters the field ?

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and let you retract this part. Surely you don't think this rule has anything at all to do with the OP.[/QUOTE]

No retraction it just justifies not allowing a runner to reenter the field after leaving it. If the Runner did not touch the plate and leaves the field they cannot comeback that's all I am saying. It still has to be an apeal!

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by MD

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and let you retract this part. Surely you don't think this rule has anything at all to do with the OP.

Originally Posted by Insane Blue

No retraction it just justifies not allowing a runner to reenter the field after leaving it. If the Runner did not touch the plate and leaves the field they cannot comeback that's all I am saying. It still has to be an apeal!

Wondering if things were renumbered... (I don't have the 2013 book handy)

If not... the rule you quote, 8-7-U, is about runner abandoning their base and going to the dugout. Has nothing to do with players that are no longer runners. A runner who has scored has no different status than any other player in the dugout. It's not ILLEGAL (as in, something you penalize) to leave the dugout. It is illegal to interfere, regardless of who you are. It is not the leaving of the dugout that is illegal.

[Insane Blue]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Wondering if things were renumbered... (I don't have the 2013 book handy)

If not... the rule you quote, 8-7-U, is about runner abandoning their base and going to the dugout. Has nothing to do with players that are no longer runners. A runner who has scored has no different status than any other player in the dugout. It's not ILLEGAL (as in, something you penalize) to leave the dugout. It is illegal to interfere, regardless of who you are. It is not the leaving of the dugout that is illegal.

No that it is it. when she left the field she abandoned the base which is home plate. When she enters the Dugout she becomes bench personnel and bench personnel is not aloud to enter the playing field during live ball play.

Now to get back to the OP.

The runner may not leave the field and then return to touch the base she missed which is home plate. If the Defense makes a proper appeal the runner would be out plain and simple.

Do you agree with this yes or no?

[MD Longhorn]

Of course I do.

But I'm done being trolled. (Abandonment at home plate... I've heard everything now. So much for being more than a rookie)

Have a good weekend.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by Insane Blue

The runner may not leave the field and then return to touch the base she missed which is home plate.

Wow. A runner misses the plate and heads into her dugout, and you want to characterize that as abandonment?

No way. Abandonment calls for the umpire to rule the runner out without the need for an appeal. You would never rule a runner out for failing to touch the plate and entering the dugout without an appeal.

[Insane Blue]

Abbandoment is not the issue it's going leaving the playing field and coming back onto it.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by Insane Blue

Abbandoment is not the issue it's going leaving the playing field and coming back onto it.

Agree. But you brought up abandonment when you said (and sorry, I quoted the wrong thing in my previous post):

Originally Posted by Insane Blue

No that it is it. when she left the field she abandoned the base which is home plate.

[Insane Blue]

Originally Posted by Manny A

Agree. But you brought up abandonment when you said (and sorry, I quoted the wrong thing in my previous post):

You are correct.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Insane Blue

Abbandoment is not the issue

Of course it's not. Which is why you were taken to task for quoting the abandonment rule.

[EsqUmp]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Wondering if things were renumbered... (I don't have the 2013 book handy)

If not... the rule you quote, 8-7-U, is about runner abandoning their base and going to the dugout. Has nothing to do with players that are no longer runners. A runner who has scored has no different status than any other player in the dugout. It's not ILLEGAL (as in, something you penalize) to leave the dugout. It is illegal to interfere, regardless of who you are. It is not the leaving of the dugout that is illegal.

First, I'll say that I am going to have a heard time calling any sort of interference unless I see something overt.

But, with respect to the player leaving the dugout, it is in fact, illegal. She does not have a legal reason to be outside the dugout once she has crossed home plate and entered the dugout. Her running responsibilities are over and rule permits her to be out of the dugout. Team members are only permitted out of the dugout when the rules allow. No rule allows her to be out of the dugout in this case.

By rule, you have to ask yourself, "What rule permits this team member to be out of the dugout?" If there isn't one, she is required to be in the dugout.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by EsqUmp

First, I'll say that I am going to have a heard time calling any sort of interference unless I see something overt.

But, with respect to the player leaving the dugout, it is in fact, illegal. She does not have a legal reason to be outside the dugout once she has crossed home plate and entered the dugout. Her running responsibilities are over and rule permits her to be out of the dugout. Team members are only permitted out of the dugout when the rules allow. No rule allows her to be out of the dugout in this case.

By rule, you have to ask yourself, "What rule permits this team member to be out of the dugout?" If there isn't one, she is required to be in the dugout.

Not completely true. Scored and retired runners are not required to vaporize - they just can't interfere. Further, many scored runners will stay around the plate to coach a potential slide / no slide - this is not illegal (unless, of course, said scored runner interferes with something).

[EsqUmp]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Not completely true. Scored and retired runners are not required to vaporize - they just can't interfere. Further, many scored runners will stay around the plate to coach a potential slide / no slide - this is not illegal (unless, of course, said scored runner interferes with something).

THAT IS NOT THE SAME THING AS A RETIRED RUNNER GOING INTO THE DUGOUT AND COMING BACK OUT.

You've changed the scenario. What in my statement is inaccurate?

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by EsqUmp

THAT IS NOT THE SAME THING AS A RETIRED RUNNER GOING INTO THE DUGOUT AND COMING BACK OUT.

Why yell? You can make your point without engaging the Caps Lock button.

Are you suggesting that a retired runner becomes someone else when she enters the dugout? Is there a rule cite for that?

The rules are clear that a retired (or scored) runner cannot enter the dugout, and then come back out to correct base running mistakes. But I've never seen anything that says once she enters the dugout, she can no longer come back out to do other things like direct a teammate to slide at home.

Seriously (and without shouting), is there something that says her status as a retired (or scored) runner changes the moment she steps into DBT?

[Insane Blue]

Originally Posted by Manny A

Why yell? You can make your point without engaging the Caps Lock button.

Are you suggesting that a retired runner becomes someone else when she enters the dugout? Is there a rule cite for that?

The rules are clear that a retired (or scored) runner cannot enter the dugout, and then come back out to correct base running mistakes. But I've never seen anything that says once she enters the dugout, she can no longer come back out to do other things like direct a teammate to slide at home.

Seriously (and without shouting), is there something that says her status as a retired (or scored) runner changes the moment she steps into DBT?

Yes Rule 3-6-6 covers who may be outside of the dugout and for what reasons. When the Retired Runner enters the dugout she becomes bench personal and is governed by this rule.

Are you telling us that a bench player other than the on deck player can leave the dugout to tell a player to slide during a live ball.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by EsqUmp

What in my statement is inaccurate?

I'm trying to find a rule or any citation whatsoever that converts a runner who has scored into something else the instant a toe touches dugout. I can't find such a thing. You seem to think she does, so I'll ask you to find the cite.