Ground Rules/Pre-Game Coaches' Conference

[Dutch Alex]

Originally Posted by Steve M

Missed you this year at the cup, Sander

I've missed myself not only this year on the Cup
Since my son started playing rugby (he's 9yr old) 5 years ago, I have difficulty in winter time to make some time free for softball.
I shall not be surprised if my wife starts to make problems in summertime about me umpiring in softball...

I've seen some pic's on the site from our national teams: Dutch Women Softball Teams - Official Website
Looked like you had a good time as group of umpires. Jealous? Yes!!! For not being there.

[KSRef]

At our State H.S. rules meeting last night (Kansas) we were instructed to record the number of bats we inspected before the game. At the home plate conference we are to advise the coach of how many bats we checked and ask him/her if that is correct. "Coach we checked 10 bats is that all of them?" With the increased penalty for players using illegal bats (player AND coach ejection) they want to be sure the coach has an opportunity to let us know if we got them all.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by KSRef

At our State H.S. rules meeting last night (Kansas) we were instructed to record the number of bats we inspected before the game. At the home plate conference we are to advise the coach of how many bats we checked and ask him/her if that is correct. "Coach we checked 10 bats is that all of them?" With the increased penalty for players using illegal bats (player AND coach ejection) they want to be sure the coach has an opportunity to let us know if we got them all.

Yeah, but too many coaches/players have figured that out. They bring out 12 bats for inspection, pull out 3 hot bats when you leave the dugout, and put 3 other bats back in the bags.

I'm all for telling the coaches to take EVERY bat out of EVERY bag found in the dugout. I won't reach into the bags to verify, but all I have to do is tap the back of the bag to tell if there's something else inside.

I don't buy that "oh, we won't use that bat today" crap. Just wait until the 4th or 5th inning when they're down by 5, and it magically appears.

But that's a whole different topic for another thread.

[Steve M]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

Yeah, but too many coaches/players have figured that out. They bring out 12 bats for inspection, pull out 3 hot bats when you leave the dugout, and put 3 other bats back in the bags.

I'm all for telling the coaches to take EVERY bat out of EVERY bag found in the dugout. I won't reach into the bags to verify, but all I have to do is tap the back of the bag to tell if there's something else inside.

I don't buy that "oh, we won't use that bat today" crap. Just wait until the 4th or 5th inning when they're down by 5, and it magically appears.

But that's a whole different topic for another thread.

And I'm all for doing what Fed baseball is doing beginning this year - no inspection. The responsibility belongs entirely to the team. Use an illegal bat? OK, I have a book rule to handle that. ASA and all the other sanctioning bodies want us to inspect the bats - it's a worthless as background checks.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Steve M

And I'm all for doing what Fed baseball is doing beginning this year - no inspection. The responsibility belongs entirely to the team. Use an illegal bat? OK, I have a book rule to handle that. ASA and all the other sanctioning bodies want us to inspect the bats - it's a worthless as background checks.

Well, NFHS is a different animal as the coaches are acting in loco parentis and do have the authority to speak for the minor.

The bat check is a bit of preventive maintenance, but as noted before, if someone really wants to cheat, there isn't much that can be done about it.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by Steve M

And I'm all for doing what Fed baseball is doing beginning this year - no inspection. The responsibility belongs entirely to the team. Use an illegal bat? OK, I have a book rule to handle that. ASA and all the other sanctioning bodies want us to inspect the bats - it's a worthless as background checks.

It won't prevent the real cheaters from getting those bats into the game, but it's a good procedure to help keep bad equipment off of the field. And by "bad equipment," I mean bats that have cracks in them or bats that aren't on the Approved Bat List.

[Steve M]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

It won't prevent the real cheaters from getting those bats into the game, but it's a good procedure to help keep bad equipment off of the field. And by "bad equipment," I mean bats that have cracks in them or bats that aren't on the Approved Bat List.

OK, I'll ask further - why is it my job to do that. It's like a lock - it may keep those who are honest honest - but there's no guarantee. Once the game starts, my eyes are on the field, not looking for equipment changes in the dugout/bench area.
Don't misunderstand, I do the inspections, as completely and thouroughly as possible - but I disagree that it should be my job in the game. Especially since I have a book rule that covers violations

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by Steve M

OK, I'll ask further - why is it my job to do that. It's like a lock - it may keep those who are honest honest - but there's no guarantee. Once the game starts, my eyes are on the field, not looking for equipment changes in the dugout/bench area.
Don't misunderstand, I do the inspections, as completely and thouroughly as possible - but I disagree that it should be my job in the game. Especially since I have a book rule that covers violations

Because ASA says it's our job as part of the pre-game equipment inspection.

In FP, the bats aren't nearly as big an issue as they are in SP. SP just seems to have a lot more problems with players trying to sneak in equipment that doesn't belong, so we check 'em before the game.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by KSRef

At our State H.S. rules meeting last night (Kansas) we were instructed to record the number of bats we inspected before the game. At the home plate conference we are to advise the coach of how many bats we checked and ask him/her if that is correct. "Coach we checked 10 bats is that all of them?" With the increased penalty for players using illegal bats (player AND coach ejection) they want to be sure the coach has an opportunity to let us know if we got them all.

I believe this college mechanic to be a waste of time and effort. A courtesy check is more of a passive deterent, but has minimal effect on anyone who wants to cheat. Counting and recounting is like throwing good money after bad.

[Andy]

Originally Posted by KSRef

At our State H.S. rules meeting last night (Kansas) we were instructed to record the number of bats we inspected before the game. At the home plate conference we are to advise the coach of how many bats we checked and ask him/her if that is correct. "Coach we checked 10 bats is that all of them?" With the increased penalty for players using illegal bats (player AND coach ejection) they want to be sure the coach has an opportunity to let us know if we got them all.

In AZ, we request that the team have all of their bats and helmets put outside the dugout for inspection. It is not required, but most teams do it. Umpires are instructed not to enter dugouts to inspect equipment, if a bat or helmet is seen inside the dugout, we politely ask the coach to bring it out for us. If the response is "Oh, we don't use that bat", we let it go.

Personally - I'm with Steve...this is the coach's responsibility and I have a rule book that tells me what to do if the rule concerning bats is violated.

[tcannizzo]

Here is the ultimate solution. And a money maker for somebody.
Require that all bats have a bar code, and the umpire with a bar code scanner. Not sure that bat was checked? Just scan it. Illegal bats would immediately be flagged.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by tcannizzo

Here is the ultimate solution. And a money maker for somebody.
Require that all bats have a bar code, and the umpire with a bar code scanner. Not sure that bat was checked? Just scan it. Illegal bats would immediately be flagged.

Won't solve a thing. Bar codes can easily be faked, and I'm not scanning each and every bat at each at-bat.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by tcannizzo

Here is the ultimate solution. And a money maker for somebody.
Require that all bats have a bar code, and the umpire with a bar code scanner. Not sure that bat was checked? Just scan it. Illegal bats would immediately be flagged.

Actually, there was an attempt a few years ago to have tamper-proof sensors installed in the bat that could be read by a scanner which would would give the specs of the bat. It was attached in a way the bat could not be shaven. It could probably be rolled, but would probably disconnect if done improperly.

But it could not guarantee the compression and would have been costly, so I think it was just dropped. But still someone was at least thinking of a way to make things better.