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I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'” West Houston Mike |
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What some people overlook, except in NCAA or another org with similar mechanic, is that an umpre should go for help when the umpire believes it is possible some element of the play could have been missed, not because a coach asks you to get help. If you have no doubt that you saw the every element of the play and rendered the proper decision, it is not inappropriate to respectfully decline. If asked, just tell the coach you saw the play/swing and made the appropriate ruling. And, yes, I know a check swing isn't the easiest thing to see, but sometimes it is a no brainer.
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The bat issue in softball is as much about liability, insurance and litigation as it is about competition, inflated egos and softball. |
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what im saying is, why the need to protect the batter who 1) swung and 2) made no effort to run to 1B when there is no downside to running |
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You're all over thinking this.
x-2 count, she checks, and F2 drops the ball? Just ring her up and be done with it. ![]() ![]()
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We see with our eyes. Fans and parents see with their hearts. |
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Holding the batter to the standard of running every time you call ball on a check swing that hits the ground is not a good idea (especially in the case listed here).
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I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'” West Houston Mike |
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Our job is to call the game; the game they play, no matter how well or badly they play it. If the batter swings, and we miss it, and they appeal it, then we answer what they did. The entire reason the check swing appeal even exists is recognition that the plate umpire does NOT have the best view when tracking a pitch, as should be done. The base umpire has a better angle, and makes the call when asked by the plate umpire. We didn't put the batter in jeopardy; the swing and subsequent appeal did. Definition of appeal: "A play on which an umpire may not make a decision until asked". To decide to refuse to honor a legitimate appeal that you WOULD honor with one strike, only because the dropped third strike rule would apply with two strikes, is total BS in my opinion.
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Steve ASA/ISF/NCAA/NFHS/PGF |
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On a D3K and a checked swing, I'm going for help immediately to minimize any confusion caused by a delay. That's what I was taught. It makes sense paricularly in NCAA play, but I do at all levels. Of course I check when asked at all levels too. I've never understood why a PU wouldn't.
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I'm not suggesting an umpire not go for help if there is a question, but questioning why the umpire would go if s/he believes they ($.02 to Dakota) saw the entire situation and there was nothing to miss.
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The bat issue in softball is as much about liability, insurance and litigation as it is about competition, inflated egos and softball. |
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I'm probably just as confident as the next person about trusting my judgement, but believing is not knowing. We all know there are situations where we may not have the best view of things. A possible checked swing is one of them. I'm curious to hear your general or specific reason not to check if asked. |
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I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'” West Houston Mike |
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Try this one. R1 misses 2nd on the way to 3rd; ball is thrown into the dugout. R1 doesn't retrace and retouch 2nd, so umpire awards home. Defense then appeals that R1 missed 2nd. Do you now refuse to honor the appeal because the defense waited, and the offense failed to retrace to touch? Do you accept the argument by OC that R1 WOULD have retraced had you announced what you might rule if appealed, or started the appeal before it actually was appealed, and that the delay in the appeal is now a delayed or reversed call where you must protect R1? Tell me what the difference is, then (assuming you have the answers I expect). In both cases, the offense is in jeopardy because of an act by the offense. In both cases, the "appeal" is a delayed act. In which case do we refuse to rule?
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Steve ASA/ISF/NCAA/NFHS/PGF |
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This is very much a different "appeal". In your example, the offense transgressed and the umpire makes NO CALL. The appeal is to the umpire - not to overturn a call but to rule on whether the offense did, in fact, transgress. In the other, the umpire HAS made a call - the appeal is more similar to asking your partner if he had a pulled foot or missed on a swipe tag - asking for more information from your partner in order to change your call. And in ANY of those situations, if someone (either side) was disadvantaged by the changed call - we rectify it (and, by rule, are required to do so!).
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I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'” West Houston Mike |
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EDIT: if the PU thinks the swing wasnt close enough to warrant going for help in the first place, i dont see why they would go for help once asked by the C or DC |
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