Just an interesting game

[tcannizzo]

How many games have little to no entertainment value from an umpire's perspective?

Today in a 12-U friendly we had a number of calls in just one game that caused my partner and I to comment to each other afterwards, that you just don't see this much in any single game. (It should be noted that not a single one of these caused any heartburn to any of the coaches. At worst, just mild curiosity about the outcomes of certain of the rulings.) Nothing particularly spectacular about the calls, except that these all happened in a single game.

1st pitch of the game - ILLEGAL PITCH - (P "walked through" her delivery as she took PP, without stopping to simulate taking the sign.) B hits a single to OF. Of course, we just let the play stand. Later coach wanted to know why B got to stay at 1B. He was a baseball guy where the closest thing they have to an IP is a Balk, which is a dead ball. Explained the difference in SB DDB logic that why should we penalize the offense for an infraction committed by defense.

R1 on 1B. B hits ground ball to F4 (playing deep) who instead of tossing to F6 at 2B, tried to tag R1, but missed. NO TAG!

R1 on 2B. B hits ground ball to F6. R1 passes immediatly in front of F6, who was attempting to field the ground ball, but had to flinch to avoid R1. DEAD BALL INT, award B 1B. This might deserve its own thread, but in spite of the INT, F6 throw to 1B actually beat BR. I "think" we ruled properly by awarding B 1B, but it seems counter intuitive to penalize the defense for an infraction committed by the offense. Did we get this one right? After all how can you get a put out after the ball has already been declared as Dead?

R1 on 2B. B bunts up 1B line. F3 fields the bunt and attempts to tag BR. There was no tag, but we have OUT for being more than 3ft out of the base path. It was so obvious that BU did not even need to go to PU for help and made the call from C.

B is up with less than 2 strikes and attempts to bunt. Ball strikes bat and proceeds back to F2, with a noticable reduction in speed and a change in direction where F2 tried to make the catch. Ball first strikes F2's chest protector then falls down to the up-turned mitt, but bounces out and hits the ground. FOUL BALL. How many times has this scenario been discussed vis-a-vis FOUL TIP. Had she caught the ball, we would have had the OUT.

Different B is up with less than 2 strikes and attempts to bunt. Ball is popped up 15-20 feet up and along the 1B line about 15-20 feet. F2 is following B, until B stops (apparently not exactly sure where the ball was and thinking it was foul) F2 who has a reasonable chance to catch the pop up, rear-ends B. DEAD BALL INT, B OUT.

Well, all the interesting plays didn't happen in one game, this one happened in the 2nd game of a DH between the same two teams.

B with less than 2 strikes attempts to bunt the ball. Ball is popped up about 10 ft high about 3 feet in front of HP. Batted discards bat in front of HP and takes off for 1B. As the bat is stationery on the ground, the popped up bunt comes down and strikes the bat. Ball ricochets off bat and goes foul before it is touched by any defender. FOUL BALL.

Just seemed like a lot to happen in such a short time span.

[derwil]

Originally Posted by tcannizzo

R1 on 2B. B hits ground ball to F6. R1 passes immediatly in front of F6, who was attempting to field the ground ball, but had to flinch to avoid R1. DEAD BALL INT, award B 1B. This might deserve its own thread, but in spite of the INT, F6 throw to 1B actually beat BR. I "think" we ruled properly by awarding B 1B, but it seems counter intuitive to penalize the defense for an infraction committed by the offense. Did we get this one right? After all how can you get a put out after the ball has already been declared as Dead?

You've got a dead ball situation. The throw never happened so it doesn't matter if the BR appeared to get beaten by the throw. Offense is penalized because they now have an out and a runner at first instead of no outs an a runner at third (if the BR was indeed thrown out @ 1st). While if the penalty for the interference was some sort of DDB where both runners could be out on the same play would be the best scenario, that is not in the rulebook.

You ruled correctly.

[DeputyUICHousto]

Originally Posted by tcannizzo

R1 on 2B. B bunts up 1B line. F3 fields the bunt and attempts to tag BR. There was no tag, but we have OUT for being more than 3ft out of the base path. It was so obvious that BU did not even need to go to PU for help and made the call from C.

It might have been obvious but tough to "sell" this call from that angle IMO.

[BretMan]

Originally Posted by tcannizzo

He was a baseball guy where the closest thing they have to an IP is a Balk, which is a dead ball.

It's a dead ball in FED only. And there are illegal pitches in baseball. They're pitching infractions that occur with no runners on base. When you have runners on base, illegal pitches become balks.

We now return to our regularly scheduled softball rules discussion...

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by BretMan

We now return to our regularly scheduled softball rules discussion...

Good !

[tcannizzo]

Originally Posted by DeputyUICHousto

It might have been obvious but tough to "sell" this call from that angle IMO.

Sure, but this one sold itself.

[Andy]

Originally Posted by tcannizzo

R1 on 2B. B hits ground ball to F6. R1 passes immediatly in front of F6, who was attempting to field the ground ball, but had to flinch to avoid R1. DEAD BALL INT, award B 1B. This might deserve its own thread, but in spite of the INT, F6 throw to 1B actually beat BR. I "think" we ruled properly by awarding B 1B, but it seems counter intuitive to penalize the defense for an infraction committed by the offense. Did we get this one right? After all how can you get a put out after the ball has already been declared as Dead?

As previously stated, you got it right.

I had pretty much this same play in a rec league game a few years back, with the difference being that I had the defensive coach on the field asking why he didn't get to have BOTH outs!

I explained the immediate dead ball aspect of interference and how nothing else can happen after the call is made. He didn't like it, grumbled a bit, but managed to keep himself in the game.

[Rich Ives]

Originally Posted by tcannizzo

Sure, but this one sold itself.

Does the runner establish her own baseline as would happen in baseball?

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by Rich Ives

Does the runner establish her own baseline as would happen in baseball?

No; the baselines are straight direct lines (the shortest distance between two points) between the bases. Two of the four coincide with the foul lines.

Runners do create their own base paths, however. Once a runner recognizes a defensive player with the ball is attempting to tag her, the base path is a direct line from that current spot to the base toward which the runner is headed; and the runner may not vary more than 3' from that (now) established base path.

These are both defined terms, and not interchangable.

[tcannizzo]

Originally Posted by Rich Ives

Does the runner establish her own baseline as would happen in baseball?

That's a trick question. The answer is no. The baseline is established by chalk. But the basepath is established by the runner.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Rich Ives

Does the runner establish her own baseline as would happen in baseball?

The terms differ, but the enforcement is identical.

[SRW]

Originally Posted by tcannizzo

That's a trick question. The answer is no. The baseline is established by chalk. But the basepath is established by the runner.

Does Metro Atlanta chalk the baseline between 1B and 2B?

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by SRW

Does Metro Atlanta chalk the baseline between 1B and 2B?

Depends on who's brother-in-law or cousin, could be the same, owns the local chalk business.

[tcannizzo]

Originally Posted by SRW

Does Metro Atlanta chalk the baseline between 1B and 2B?

Actually, no. And neither is the baseline between 2B and 3B.
Well played, SWR.

[SRW]

Originally Posted by tcannizzo

Actually, no. And neither is the baseline between 2B and 3B.
Well played, SWR.

SWR? Now you've mistaken me for underground pipes?

You're a train wreck.