DP Flex rule???

[slowballbaker]

Need help with this one...

A team starts with the DP/Flex. At the start of the game the coach tells the umpires that the DP will enter the game to pitch.

The DP then bats and gets on base, so the Flex enters the game and runs for the DP. Would this be considered a courtesy runner or a substitution or neither...

The next half inning the DP re-enters for the flex and pitches continues to pitch.

Then the next time the DP bats she gets on base again, then the Flex enters the game and runs for the DP again...

Questions: Is the DP/Flex under the same one re-enty rule???
Would the DP be a dead player at this time??
Or would this be considered a courtesy for the pitcher?

Thanks

[AtlUmpSteve]

Let's start with some basic rules.

A legal courtesy runner must be a player not currently nor has ever been in the game. The FLEX is in the game, so cannot be a courtesy runner.

You stated the DP is pitching; if that is for the FLEX, and the FLEX is not playing defensively elsewhere, the FLEX has left the game. But, that isn't mentioned, so I hope it isn't the case, since the FLEX can only reenter once!!

So, assuming the FLEX is still playing defense somewhere, then the FLEX running for the DP is a substitution for the DP (if DP is not on offense, the DP has left the game. When the DP returns to pitch, it must be reported, and the starting DP has used her one reentry.

When the FLEX runs a 2nd time, that is also legal, but it is, again, a substitution for the DP. That player has used her one legal reentry, and may not reenter again. The team may now enter a substitute, and that person is now the new DP, and/or may use any player currently in the lineup to pitch. But the starting DP is done for the game.

When you allowed the second reentry by the DP, that was incorrect. And this was an illegal player, that could (should) have been appealed by the opposition.

[PSUchem]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

Let's start with some basic rules.

A legal courtesy runner must be a player not currently nor has ever been in the game. The FLEX is in the game, so cannot be a courtesy runner.

You stated the DP is pitching; if that is for the FLEX, and the FLEX is not playing defensively elsewhere, the FLEX has left the game. But, that isn't mentioned, so I hope it isn't the case, since the FLEX can only reenter once!!

So, assuming the FLEX is still playing defense somewhere, then the FLEX running for the DP is a substitution for the DP (if DP is not on offense, the DP has left the game. When the DP returns to pitch, it must be reported, and the starting DP has used her one reentry.

When the FLEX runs a 2nd time, that is also legal, but it is, again, a substitution for the DP. That player has used her one legal reentry, and may not reenter again. The team may now enter a substitute, and that person is now the new DP, and/or may use any player currently in the lineup to pitch. But the starting DP is done for the game.

When you allowed the second reentry by the DP, that was incorrect. And this was an illegal player, that could (should) have been appealed by the opposition.

Steve, not sure where you are seeing an illegal second reentry.

"A team starts with the DP/Flex. At the start of the game the coach tells the umpires that the DP will enter the game to pitch. "
Let's assume, as Steve said, that the FLEX is still playing defense and has not left the game. Nothing has occurred for the DP at this point.

"The DP then bats and gets on base, so the Flex enters the game and runs for the DP."
As Steve said, this is a substitution for the DP, and the DP has left the game. The team has now dropped to 9 in the batting order.

"The next half inning the DP re-enters for the flex and pitches continues to pitch."
Fine, the DP used her one re-entry.

"Then the next time the DP bats she gets on base again, then the Flex enters the game and runs for the DP again."
The DP, after re-entering, remained in the game and batted in this inning. NOW the FLEX substitutes for her again. At this point, the DP player is done for the game.


Of course, if the coach tried to put the DP back in AGAIN, this would be an illegal substitution. But as written by the OP, this is legal.

"Questions: Is the DP/Flex under the same one re-enty rule???"
Yes.

"Would the DP be a dead player at this time??"
Yes.

"Or would this be considered a courtesy for the pitcher?"
No, see above.

[AtlUmpSteve]

OK; it was 2:14 am, and I had a few adult beverages from about 9:30, after my games.

[PSUchem]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

OK; it was 2:14 am, and I had a few adult beverages from about 9:30, after my games.

Understandable, of course.

[marvin]

Originally Posted by PSUchem

.....

"Then the next time the DP bats she gets on base again, then the Flex enters the game and runs for the DP again."
The DP, after re-entering, remained in the game and batted in this inning. NOW the FLEX substitutes for her again. At this point, the DP player is done for the game.


Of course, if the coach tried to put the DP back in AGAIN, this would be an illegal substitution. But as written by the OP, this is legal.

I am guessing that you mean that the player who started at the DP position is done for the game and that the team could re-enter another player as sub for the starting DP and the line-up would again be at ten players.

[CelticNHBlue]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

...that could (should) have been appealed by the opposition.

And to bust your ball bag a little, of course you meant protest and not appeal

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by slowballbaker

Need help with this one...

A team starts with the DP/Flex. At the start of the game the coach tells the umpires that the DP will enter the game to pitch.

The DP then bats and gets on base, so the Flex enters the game and runs for the DP. Would this be considered a courtesy runner or a substitution or neither...

The next half inning the DP re-enters for the flex and pitches continues to pitch.

Then the next time the DP bats she gets on base again, then the Flex enters the game and runs for the DP again...

Questions: Is the DP/Flex under the same one re-enty rule???
Would the DP be a dead player at this time??
Or would this be considered a courtesy for the pitcher?

Thanks

The main point Steve was brewing is that a lot depends on whether the FLEX player leaves the game when the DP player is pitching.
In one strategy, she does. If so, that player can only run for the DP once, because that is a re-entry.
In the alternate strategy Steve was fermenting, the FLEX player just assumes some other defense position, so that FLEX player has not left the game. If so, that player can run for a DP more than once, but the original DP player can only return once.

Re-entry is about players, not positions, so each individual player is allowed and limited to one re-entry; regardless of what position they occupy. Each player including those identified as DP or FLEX is treated separately for re-entry.