2009 advanced FP camp

[ronald]

Originally Posted by ronald

And when you are on the line and the play brings F3 directly toward you to field a batted ball and the play is to F1 at 1B, where are you going to go?

Sorry, no context. Ball hit to right field, play at 1B.

Originally Posted by ronald

Anybody remind them that it isn't possible to have a force play at 1B?

Already fixed that.

Originally Posted by ronald

Believe that was a huge issue at last year's Advance SP Camp.

Only 15 campers this year.

[wadeintothem]

Gotta agree about rimming. I was working a NAFA tournament and practicing rim and I got caught behind the runner when left field pooched a can of corn that suddenly turned into a triple. Its not that great of positioning. I'm fast enough that it didnt hurt too badly, but had I been inside, I would have done better. Rim is great to be lazy. Its purpose is so you dont come in unnecessarily. Of course you never really know when that is. You never know. Rimming has no place in 2 man mechanics at all.

Do not agree on a ball hit to RF or any congested play at 1B where fielders are converging to the umpires calling area or a ball will be thrown through there. But thats the way it is. There are times when the best 90 is in foul territory - to eliminate that removes any need to be a student of the game for plays at 1.

In fact, you should go there in many instances, PU take 2-3 and BU rotate home.

I guess thats too complicated though for the 38,999 umpires.. so thats the way it goes.

[azbigdawg]

Originally Posted by wadeintothem

Gotta agree about rimming. I was working a NAFA tournament and practicing rim and I got caught behind the runner when left field pooched a can of corn that suddenly turned into a triple. Its not that great of positioning. I'm fast enough that it didnt hurt too badly, but had I been inside, I would have done better. Rim is great to be lazy. Its purpose is so you dont come in unnecessarily. Of course you never really know when that is. You never know. Rimming has no place in 2 man mechanics at all.
Do not agree on a ball hit to RF or any congested play at 1B where fielders are converging to the umpires calling area or a ball will be thrown through there. But thats the way it is. There are times when the best 90 is in foul territory - to eliminate that removes any need to be a student of the game for plays at 1.

In fact, you should go there in many instances, PU take 2-3 and BU rotate home.

I guess thats too complicated though for the 38,999 umpires.. so thats the way it goes.

This is my once (or maybe twice) a year agreeing with Wade. In 3 man...I can see staying outside at 1b, because you have 3u in front of you to come up and cover 2nd. Its a HORRBILE mechanic in two man. Younger (inexperienced) umpires MUST be taught how to get inside and get all the elements in front of you. Its a basic concept. If you stay outside you WILL get stuck behind a runner on an overthrow, bobble, etc if you are not careful, and possibly even if you are. The local hs organization experimented with the mechaninc this year, and all I saw was new umpires getting caught, and getting in the way of throws...

[Dakota]

No comment on wade's notion that BU should rotate home in 2 man?

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by Dakota

No comment on wade's notion that BU should rotate home in 2 man?

Interesting concept he proposes.

Wade, would you like to clarify that mechanic? I'm open to hearing what you have to say about it...

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

Interesting concept he proposes.

Wade, would you like to clarify that mechanic? I'm open to hearing what you have to say about it...

Any time BU's job is to pick his nose while PU's job is at 3, BU should be home and actually have a job besides relaxing spectator.


Another example than above is hit and run or bunt (R1@ 1B) where the out is to 1B and PU takes the banger at 3B. BU should be home.
What else does he have to do?

Why should PU be forced to follow R1 home if the play goes that way?

BU should be gainfully employed covering home.

Its common sense.

[IRISHMAFIA]

No comment on wade's notion that BU should rotate home in 2 man?

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

Interesting concept he proposes.

Wade, would you like to clarify that mechanic? I'm open to hearing what you have to say about it...

That's so easy, it is almost embarassing. One simple sentence, "Who is covering 2B?"

[wadeintothem]

For the hit and run, if there was potential of a play at 2B - (Ie the BR is safe or there is a run down)

BU would never rotate home.

BU would only rotate home with communication to his partner when he is no longer employed.

This same concept applies when he is "out and should stay out" - such as an outside foul line call at 1B.

Well at least cover home. BU doesnt need to spectate or cheerlead the PU, they can be employed at home.

IF BR is safe on the hit and run - BU should never rotate home.

I dont think that would be too difficult to teach to a national level umpire.

Even texas baseball umpires understand it

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

No comment on wade's notion that BU should rotate home in 2 man?



That's so easy, it is almost embarassing. One simple sentence, "Who is covering 2B?"

Dave,

Still waiting on an answer

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by azbigdawg

This is my once (or maybe twice) a year agreeing with Wade. In 3 man...I can see staying outside at 1b, because you have 3u in front of you to come up and cover 2nd. Its a HORRBILE mechanic in two man. Younger (inexperienced) umpires MUST be taught how to get inside and get all the elements in front of you. Its a basic concept. If you stay outside you WILL get stuck behind a runner on an overthrow, bobble, etc if you are not careful, and possibly even if you are.

On another site, someone made the comment that problems (drop, bobble, misplay, etc.) happen often enough that our mechanics including a planned hesistation are based around those scenarios.

My response was that our mechanics especially a hesitation are taught in anticipation of being prepared for the rare and infrequent problem. The standard plays are easy, but the "surprise", unexpected misplay is when an umpire is really put to the test.

Getting caught out of position or making a call trailing a runner doesn't seem to be that big a deal until that one time you just cannot see a play and miss the call because the runner or fielder moved in an unexpected manner. And, unfortunately, that is the call EVERYONE is going to see and remember.

[Andy]

Originally Posted by wadeintothem

Gotta agree about rimming. I was working a NAFA tournament and practicing rim and I got caught behind the runner when left field pooched a can of corn that suddenly turned into a triple. Its not that great of positioning. I'm fast enough that it didnt hurt too badly, but had I been inside, I would have done better. Rim is great to be lazy. Its purpose is so you dont come in unnecessarily. Of course you never really know when that is. You never know. Rimming has no place in 2 man mechanics at all.

Wade - you say this (emphasized above), but in another post you say that an umpire should not be spectating while his partner is working.

My question on the situation posted above is: What was your PU doing? Assuming that you started in A position with no runners and were staying on the rim on the fly ball to left, your PU should pick up third for you. This is how I always pregame the rim mechanic. (except in any games I work for Darrell!)

I am a supporter of the rim mechanic for 2 and 3 umpire mechanics, but I see it as an advanced mechanic that should only be employed by experienced umpires.