2009 advanced FP camp

[ronald]

1. Wade, there will not be in NCAA mechanics coming into ASA. Mike has explained the reason why and Kevin says if 200 NCAA top flight umps can not get rimming correct, then 39,000 ...

2. Tom, dropped third strike: Umpire's judgment as to whether interference occurred. Did not go into situations with this as felt not right moment and never brought it up again.

3. Mike, getting rid of LBR. Brought this up with Malcolm and got OK as response. Went no where.

4. 2009 umpire manual section does not have the mechanic for a play at home plate where runner misses plate and no tag and what to do. That is an omission and will be back in 2010. It is on page 186 in 2008 rule book.

5. They asked for input on how to improve the camp and drills, so if any of you have any ideas send them to Malcolm and Gene. There email addresses are in the manual. Of course, we gave some ideas but you guys can suggest too.

6. The hammer. No NCAA hammer or whatever it is. "Emily Alexander never taught it or forbid it" (Julie Johnson). A couple high ranking ASA umps did it one game in NCAA tourney and then reverted back to the ASA way cause they still want to do the big ASA, World, etc dances. And no need for a big one on every strike. Certainly not on a pitch down the middle. Verbal is the strong call.

7. On strike three after you have pulled you bow or whatever, square back up so you are ready to move either way.

8. Hell will most likely freeze over before you can go to foul ground for a play at first base on ball hit to right field. Get inside or as a last resort, open up.

9. On force plays at first base (no such thing), follow the DVD. It is the gospel.

10. On swipe tag at first base, one of the instructors told us what he has done. Instead of going towards the line which does nothing for your angle, he moves to his right to get a better view of a tag or no tag.

11. 3 man mechanic. All umps stay in on ball to outfield, ie a ground ball, line shot through the infield. PU yells 3 man.

12. Communication is lacking from NUS staff's perspective. There is not enough of it.

13. Keith Kerney and Scott Thomas are going to World Championship this year. My understanding is the men's.

Questions? If I can answer em, I will.

Ron

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by ronald

3. Getting rid of LBR. Brought this up with Malcolm and got OK as response. Went no where.

There's a shock, but shows there may be some light at the end of the tunnel.

4. 2009 umpire manual section does not have the mechanic for a play at home plate where runner misses plate and no tag and what to do. That is an omission and will be back in 2010. It is on page 186 in 2008 rule book.

It is also on page 108 of the 2009 rule book, RS #1.I[quote]

8. Hell will most likely freeze over before you can go to foul ground for a play at first base. Get inside or as a last resort, open up.

And when you are on the line and the play brings F3 directly toward you to field a batted ball and the play is to F1 at 1B, where are you going to go?

9. On force plays at first base, follow the DVD. It is the gospel.

Anybody remind them that it isn't possible to have a force play at 1B?

10. On swipe tag at first base, one of the instructors told us what he has done. Instead of going towards the line which does nothing for your angle, he moves to his right to get a better view of a tag or no tag.

Hmmm....where have I heard that before?

11. 3 man mechanic. All umps stay in on ball to outfield, ie a ground ball, line shot through the infield. PU yells 3 man.

Sounds like an OOO sexist pig.

12. Communication is lacking from NUS staff's perspective. There is not enough of it.

Believe that was a huge issue at last year's Advance SP Camp.

[ronald]

Originally Posted by ronald

And when you are on the line and the play brings F3 directly toward you to field a batted ball and the play is to F1 at 1B, where are you going to go?

Sorry, no context. Ball hit to right field, play at 1B.

Originally Posted by ronald

Anybody remind them that it isn't possible to have a force play at 1B?

Already fixed that.

Originally Posted by ronald

Believe that was a huge issue at last year's Advance SP Camp.

Only 15 campers this year.

[wadeintothem]

Gotta agree about rimming. I was working a NAFA tournament and practicing rim and I got caught behind the runner when left field pooched a can of corn that suddenly turned into a triple. Its not that great of positioning. I'm fast enough that it didnt hurt too badly, but had I been inside, I would have done better. Rim is great to be lazy. Its purpose is so you dont come in unnecessarily. Of course you never really know when that is. You never know. Rimming has no place in 2 man mechanics at all.

Do not agree on a ball hit to RF or any congested play at 1B where fielders are converging to the umpires calling area or a ball will be thrown through there. But thats the way it is. There are times when the best 90 is in foul territory - to eliminate that removes any need to be a student of the game for plays at 1.

In fact, you should go there in many instances, PU take 2-3 and BU rotate home.

I guess thats too complicated though for the 38,999 umpires.. so thats the way it goes.

[azbigdawg]

Originally Posted by wadeintothem

Gotta agree about rimming. I was working a NAFA tournament and practicing rim and I got caught behind the runner when left field pooched a can of corn that suddenly turned into a triple. Its not that great of positioning. I'm fast enough that it didnt hurt too badly, but had I been inside, I would have done better. Rim is great to be lazy. Its purpose is so you dont come in unnecessarily. Of course you never really know when that is. You never know. Rimming has no place in 2 man mechanics at all.
Do not agree on a ball hit to RF or any congested play at 1B where fielders are converging to the umpires calling area or a ball will be thrown through there. But thats the way it is. There are times when the best 90 is in foul territory - to eliminate that removes any need to be a student of the game for plays at 1.

In fact, you should go there in many instances, PU take 2-3 and BU rotate home.

I guess thats too complicated though for the 38,999 umpires.. so thats the way it goes.

This is my once (or maybe twice) a year agreeing with Wade. In 3 man...I can see staying outside at 1b, because you have 3u in front of you to come up and cover 2nd. Its a HORRBILE mechanic in two man. Younger (inexperienced) umpires MUST be taught how to get inside and get all the elements in front of you. Its a basic concept. If you stay outside you WILL get stuck behind a runner on an overthrow, bobble, etc if you are not careful, and possibly even if you are. The local hs organization experimented with the mechaninc this year, and all I saw was new umpires getting caught, and getting in the way of throws...

[Dakota]

No comment on wade's notion that BU should rotate home in 2 man?

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by Dakota

No comment on wade's notion that BU should rotate home in 2 man?

Interesting concept he proposes.

Wade, would you like to clarify that mechanic? I'm open to hearing what you have to say about it...

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by azbigdawg

This is my once (or maybe twice) a year agreeing with Wade. In 3 man...I can see staying outside at 1b, because you have 3u in front of you to come up and cover 2nd. Its a HORRBILE mechanic in two man. Younger (inexperienced) umpires MUST be taught how to get inside and get all the elements in front of you. Its a basic concept. If you stay outside you WILL get stuck behind a runner on an overthrow, bobble, etc if you are not careful, and possibly even if you are.

On another site, someone made the comment that problems (drop, bobble, misplay, etc.) happen often enough that our mechanics including a planned hesistation are based around those scenarios.

My response was that our mechanics especially a hesitation are taught in anticipation of being prepared for the rare and infrequent problem. The standard plays are easy, but the "surprise", unexpected misplay is when an umpire is really put to the test.

Getting caught out of position or making a call trailing a runner doesn't seem to be that big a deal until that one time you just cannot see a play and miss the call because the runner or fielder moved in an unexpected manner. And, unfortunately, that is the call EVERYONE is going to see and remember.

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

Interesting concept he proposes.

Wade, would you like to clarify that mechanic? I'm open to hearing what you have to say about it...

Any time BU's job is to pick his nose while PU's job is at 3, BU should be home and actually have a job besides relaxing spectator.


Another example than above is hit and run or bunt (R1@ 1B) where the out is to 1B and PU takes the banger at 3B. BU should be home.
What else does he have to do?

Why should PU be forced to follow R1 home if the play goes that way?

BU should be gainfully employed covering home.

Its common sense.

[IRISHMAFIA]

No comment on wade's notion that BU should rotate home in 2 man?

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

Interesting concept he proposes.

Wade, would you like to clarify that mechanic? I'm open to hearing what you have to say about it...

That's so easy, it is almost embarassing. One simple sentence, "Who is covering 2B?"

[wadeintothem]

For the hit and run, if there was potential of a play at 2B - (Ie the BR is safe or there is a run down)

BU would never rotate home.

BU would only rotate home with communication to his partner when he is no longer employed.

This same concept applies when he is "out and should stay out" - such as an outside foul line call at 1B.

Well at least cover home. BU doesnt need to spectate or cheerlead the PU, they can be employed at home.

IF BR is safe on the hit and run - BU should never rotate home.

I dont think that would be too difficult to teach to a national level umpire.

Even texas baseball umpires understand it

[CecilOne]

What were the questions/contexts behind these two?

9. On force plays at first base (no such thing), follow the DVD. It is the gospel.

10. On swipe tag at first base, one of the instructors told us what he has done. Instead of going towards the line which does nothing for your angle, he moves to his right to get a better view of a tag or no tag.

[ronald]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

What were the questions/contexts behind these two?

9. On force plays at first base (no such thing), follow the DVD. It is the gospel..

I do not remember a context for this one but it was emphasized a couple of times so I thought to mention it.

Originally Posted by CecilOne

10. On swipe tag at first base, one of the instructors told us what he has done. Instead of going towards the line which does nothing for your angle, he moves to his right to get a better view of a tag or no tag.

When we went to practicing drills, the instructor took it upon himself to add this.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

10. On swipe tag at first base, one of the instructors told us what he has done. Instead of going towards the line which does nothing for your angle, he moves to his right to get a better view of a tag or no tag.

Don't know about #9, but #10 was discussed ad-nauseam here.

[ronald]

Originally Posted by ronald

When we went to practicing drills, the instructor took it upon himself to add this.

Cecil, let me try to expand on this and give some context.

We were at the stations for plays at first base and the instructor brought up the swipe tag sit. He explained everything that others have about how moving to line offers no good angle and that pu does not have a good angle either and what they DVD said. But just like we have to move on swipe tags at other bases, he explained what he has done. Of course, we do this cause we have read the throw, can see it is off and the 1b is going to have to move or jump and so we move to the right to get a better view.

Now can we do that with all UIC's and not get a negative. I don't know but the NUS does want the ump to do more than get to the starting position. They want us to read and react appropriately to get the best unobstructed view. Julie did mention once to the umps: "Guys, we don't want you to be thinking where do they (instructors) want me but where do I need to get to get the best view." The four instructors at the school support that. Will all UIC think like that? We hope they will cause they are getting this philosophy from their superiors.
So, I think a play like that would be good to bring up in the ump's meeting before working with an unknown UIC.


Ron