NAFA Does Not Last Long In This Area

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by wadeintothem

Pay should be promptly, within a week or two, provided to the umpire, who is an independent contractor and deserving of pay for work provided in a timely manner.

Well, unfortunately, it isn't always that simple. I tried to make it that simple one year, but the money isn't always that quickly available. In this case, I'm referring to championship play, but it isn't only then. Colleges and high schools will not pay for games until they receive an invoice, process it and having the board issue a check. And occasionally, it can take months before the association receive remuneration for services rendered.

Appearance at the association meetings can be a factor in deciding to assign, but should not be a factor in paying them once you choose to assign them; IMO.

Again, it is not always that easy.

[whiskers_ump]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Well, unfortunately, it isn't always that simple. I tried to make it that simple one year, but the money isn't always that quickly available. In this case, I'm referring to championship play, but it isn't only then. Colleges and high schools will not pay for games until they receive an invoice, process it and having the board issue a check. And occasionally, it can take months before the association receive remuneration for services rendered.



Again, it is not always that easy.

The only pay at the plate we have is travel ball. HS and college, check sent to
the umpire that called the game by the school that was home team. Even ASA
tournaments here are pay at the plate.

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by whiskers_ump

The only pay at the plate we have is travel ball. HS and college, check sent to
the umpire that called the game by the school that was home team. Even ASA
tournaments here are pay at the plate.

That is pretty degrading IMO, and embarrassing.

But i've heard the texas umpire situation discussed a lot over at Heybucket, including this aspect. I think that area could use a little revamping. Part of that overhaul could be a more professional organization and billing system.

[topper]

Originally Posted by wadeintothem

That is pretty degrading IMO, and embarrassing.

But i've heard the texas umpire situation discussed a lot over at Heybucket, including this aspect. I think that area could use a little revamping. Part of that overhaul could be a more professional organization and billing system.

I seriously doubt that the officials; you know, the ones out on the field working, feel degraded or embarrassed by accepting their pay up front, on the field. There are several tournaments every weekend in this area. Each one with it's own assignor/UIC. What compensation for his/her duties that person negotiates with the tournament hosts is his/her concern. As Steve M said, we are independant contractors and like it that way. Please keep your "big government" approach and any revamping to yourself.

[whiskers_ump]

Originally Posted by topper

I seriously doubt that the officials; you know, the ones out on the field working, feel degraded or embarrassed by accepting their pay up front, on the field. There are several tournaments every weekend in this area. Each one with it's own assignor/UIC. What compensation for his/her duties that person negotiates with the tournament hosts is his/her concern. As Steve M said, we are independant contractors and like it that way. Please keep your "big government" approach and any revamping to yourself.

Hear Ye Hear Ye...Thank you Topper.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by topper

I seriously doubt that the officials; you know, the ones out on the field working, feel degraded or embarrassed by accepting their pay up front, on the field. There are several tournaments every weekend in this area. Each one with it's own assignor/UIC. What compensation for his/her duties that person negotiates with the tournament hosts is his/her concern. As Steve M said, we are independant contractors and like it that way. Please keep your "big government" approach and any revamping to yourself.

Well, obviously, it all depends on where you are standing as to whether this is true or not, or if such an operating format would succeed or not.

BTW, who is talking about big government?

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by topper

I seriously doubt that the officials; you know, the ones out on the field working, feel degraded or embarrassed by accepting their pay up front, on the field. There are several tournaments every weekend in this area. Each one with it's own assignor/UIC. What compensation for his/her duties that person negotiates with the tournament hosts is his/her concern. As Steve M said, we are independant contractors and like it that way. Please keep your "big government" approach and any revamping to yourself.

It's definitely a different approach than I am accustomed to. Better? I'm not sure, but I'll let it rest as it is. No purpose would be served by debating it IMO.

[topper]

Originally Posted by wadeintothem

It's definitely a different approach than I am accustomed to. Better? I'm not sure, but I'll let it rest as it is. No purpose would be served by debating it IMO.

Understand that our "approach" evolved (or devolved if you like) IMO due to the lack of a viable local or regional association. Once credability and trust are lost, it's difficult to regain them. Even when it comes to Skahtboi's precious TASO. We have been dealing with this situation so long here that change would be difficult to affect.

[bkbjones]

We can "get a draw any time," which is not true and to me is demeaning. Some of the money goes for "overhead," which we really don't have for ASA FP games. Well, I take that back. We pay an assignor who doesn't assign ASA FP tournament games. The only overhead is the eventual generation of a 1099 and the postage to send a check -- both of which are an effort of time, money and effort.

We get demeaned if we want to buy more than a case of water and a bunch of bananas for a territorial or national tournament, much less a weekend. Never mind that we are several, multiple, thousands of dollars in the black. (We're in better shape than the Big 3 auto makers.)

We have to ask for a draw which "can be done weekly." Yep. Sure can. Of course then you get put down for asking for a draw -- for our OWN money that WE have earned. Heaven forbid we should ever ever ever go to a cash system, or even allow some extremely trustworthy individual such as SRW to be able to get enough cash outta the bank to pay umpires.

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by topper

Understand that our "approach" evolved (or devolved if you like) IMO due to the lack of a viable local or regional association. Once credability and trust are lost, it's difficult to regain them. Even when it comes to Skahtboi's precious TASO. We have been dealing with this situation so long here that change would be difficult to affect.

Actually, on the other site, the Texas umpire situation is compained about quite a bit. If you read the Texas board, umpires are quite the topic. Those are your client's and they are apprarently not happy. So whatever situation is going on in Texas, it is being reflected in how your clients are perceiving you. I hope you guys are able to work out these issues.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by topper

Even when it comes to Skahtboi's precious TASO.

WTF

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Well, unfortunately, it isn't always that simple. I tried to make it that simple one year, but the money isn't always that quickly available. In this case, I'm referring to championship play, but it isn't only then. Colleges and high schools will not pay for games until they receive an invoice, process it and having the board issue a check. And occasionally, it can take months before the association receive remuneration for services rendered.



Again, it is not always that easy.

I would not put issues involving billing/red tape in the same category as intentionally withholding a private contractors pay until they attend a meeting.


I know one college assigner around here who pays once a year. Period. So thats it. If you choose to work for him, you do so knowing that.

That would hold true with your group as well, if you dont like it, dont work for your org.


I just dont agree with it.

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Again, it is not always that easy.

That is an organizational problem, not a problem for those who are doing the work.

[Steve M]

All of the high schools in this part of Pa pay at the game, via check.
Most of the colleges I see pay at the game, 'tho there are some that it takes up to 5-6 weeks. Travel reimbursement does come once a year - at the end of the season.
Summer league play - and this includes some legion & adult wood bat BB - pay at the game. And this is almost always by check.
The ISC group I work with generally pays within 3 weeks - by check.
Tournaments have always paid by the end of the last day - with the note (not exception) that some pay at the end of each day.

Maybe I've gotten spoiled by this - in looking at how some areas are paid, I kinda think I have been spoiled. Most of the games I do are not for the local district - wonder why - so Mike's area's way of paying would not impact me. I do like the idea of having some way of, not forcing but "encouraging" local meeting attendance.

[wadeintothem]

A few questions..

If its pay at the game, how does the umpire organization get paid? Is it separate billing?

How is it accounted for with a 1099 or is it?

I wish it was all cash under the table for a game, but its just not in my area. Those days are gone. HS and travel ball tournaments go through an association, with everyone getting their kick and its all by contract. This is not a handshake type deal.

It seems very different in other areas.

[Steve M]

Originally Posted by wadeintothem

A few questions..

If its pay at the game, how does the umpire organization get paid? Is it separate billing?

How is it accounted for with a 1099 or is it?

I wish it was all cash under the table for a game, but its just not in my area. Those days are gone. HS and travel ball tournaments go through an association, with everyone getting their kick and its all by contract. This is not a handshake type deal.

It seems very different in other areas.

The umpire organization does not get paid - we're independant contractors.
As for 1099's, most of the high schools and all of the colleges have W-9's, but I don't usually get to $600 in a quater for any of them. I'm in a very rural area - huge ASA district, for example, but primarily farm land which does not make for a big number population-wise.

Yeah, every area seems to be different. Like you said - if you don't like the way it's done, work elsewhere. The vast majority of the games I do are outside of my area - but that's because I like higher level games.