triple Play Stitch

[IRISHMAFIA]

Just the fact that the CF went to 3B with a throw instead of 2B or SS would give me reason to recognize an obvious appeal, but that is me.

[Dakota]

As I read Glen's OP, the question in his mind on the throw to 3B was whether it was a live ball appeal or an attempt to retire R2 on a tag.

I, too, suspect I would recognize the live ball appeal, but I wasn't there.

[whiskers_ump]

Originally Posted by Dakota

As I read Glen's OP, the question in his mind on the throw to 3B was whether it was a live ball appeal or an attempt to retire R2 on a tag.

I, too, suspect I would recognize the live ball appeal, but I wasn't there.

What made me believe F5 had no clue is, she immediately after catching the
[granted, she was on the base on inital contact of ball] ball begin chasing R2
toward 2B.
I know as umpires we are looking for outs, but I at the time, could not
see an appeal at 3rd.

[celebur]

Originally Posted by whiskers_ump

What made me believe F5 had no clue is, she immediately after catching the [granted, she was on the base on inital contact of ball] ball begin chasing R2 toward 2B.

All this really tells you is that F5 knew there weren't 3 outs yet and that R2 wasn't out yet either.

[mdntranger]

I think you all are being a little too hard on Whiskers...his OP really sounds like a HTBT situation. He made many statements and later clarifications that allow me to give the benefit of the doubt...granted unusual, but isn't that why we all sit here and post?

Here's what I'm focusing on...while keeping in mind that there's a lot of action going on with 2 runners and nobody out...

Originally Posted by whiskers_ump

-CF fires the ball to 3B, who happens to be standing on the bag, with R2 advancing from 2B

**I read this that F5 did not know that R1 left early. Usually, there's a lot of 'they left early' yelling going on that helps indicate there's an appeal (not stated, personal experience).

Originally Posted by whiskers_ump

-No obvious appeal at 3rd, and I as PU, made no call.

**This is the HTBT situation...judgement call

Originally Posted by whiskers_ump

-What made me believe F5 had no clue is, she immediately after catching the
[granted, she was on the base on inital contact of ball] ball begin chasing R2
toward 2B.
-CF's throw, IMO, was to get the advancing runner from 2nd. At the time
I did not know whether R2 left early or not, because my tag up was on R1.

**Again, judgement. Noted in this clarification, F5 began chasing the runner...it was not a catch and throw to F4. Also noted, Whiskers didn't know that R2 left early.

Perhaps the Red Herring in all this is the statement 'Everyone in the park was aware of it'. As the clarification statements came out, Whiskers didn't know R2 left early and it sounds like F5 perhaps didn't know R1 left early. We can't see the body language that Whiskers saw at the time...from his posts, though, he did not see what could be construed as an appeal.

So yes, normally this would be a textbook play...but then again if that were the case, we wouldn't be discussing it right now.

[celebur]

Originally Posted by mdntranger

I think you all are being a little too hard on Whiskers...his OP really sounds like a HTBT situation. He made many statements and later clarifications that allow me to give the benefit of the doubt...granted unusual, but isn't that why we all sit here and post?

Speaking personally, I have a lot of respect for Whiskers on this board. And I think others do too. Keeping that in mind, I don't think people are being hard on him. Rather, they're being frank with their opinions while also not denigrating or being inflammatory (i.e. they are being respectful).

As for this being a judgement call, yes, it is. And I back Whiskers all the way on making the call as he saw it.

[whiskers_ump]

Originally Posted by celebur

Speaking personally, I have a lot of respect for Whiskers on this board. And I think others do too. Keeping that in mind, I don't think people are being hard on him. Rather, they're being frank with their opinions while also not denigrating or being inflammatory (i.e. they are being respectful).

As for this being a judgement call, yes, it is. And I back Whiskers all the way on making the call as he saw it.

Thank You for the support. It was rather a HTBT stitch, however, I feel certain
that would it occur in the same manner again, my call would be the same.

[UmpireErnie]

There is no sense in us debating if what Glen saw was an obvious live ball appeal of R1 leaving 3B to early, becuase none of us saw it. Let's stipulate for a moment that when Glen watched F5 catch the throw from F8 [I]something[I] caused him to doubt if an appeal was being made on R1 or not.

Never guess an out, right?

So if he is unsure of the intent to appeal, he should not call the out.

Now what if he were to not call R1 out on appeal and she did touch the plate, and as it turned out the defense was appealing R1 leaving early as well as R2 leaving early? No problem. As soon as the defense realizes the umpire has not called R1 out someone is going to say "but she left too soon, Blue!!" Boom, now you have your appeal and the 3rd out anyway.

Whiskers, I think you got it right!

[whiskers_ump]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Just the fact that the CF went to 3B with a throw instead of 2B or SS would give me reason to recognize an obvious appeal, but that is me.

CF's throw, IMO, was to get the advancing runner from 2nd. At the time
I did not know whether R2 left early or not, because my tag up was on R1.

There was no, not one, question from the offensive team about the result
of the play. Naturally there was none from the defensive side either. Not
that it matters, these were weak 18U teams.

I agree that under most conditions this would be an easy out, but what with
the other runner advancing, I was not going to, what I felt would benefit
the defensive team, call an out when the play just did not look natural. I
don't think F5 even knew she was on the base.

[Dholloway1962]

Originally Posted by whiskers_ump

There was no, not one, question from the offensive team about the result of the play.

Of course not, they knew it was obvious she was appealed for leaving early and was out on that appeal! I believe you are thinking way too much into this whiskers. Once you see what transpired it is truly a no-brainer. Why else would F5 immediately throw the ball to 2B????????????? How can you say F5 didn't know she was standing on the base?????? I think it was apparent to everyone at the game she knew what she was doing.

[whiskers_ump]

Originally Posted by Dholloway1962

Of course not, they knew it was obvious she was appealed for leaving early and was out on that appeal! I believe you are thinking way too much into this whiskers. Once you see what transpired it is truly a no-brainer. Why else would F5 immediately throw the ball to 2B????????????? How can you say F5 didn't know she was standing on the base?????? I think it was apparent to everyone at the game she knew what she was doing.

If it was, no one, fan, coach nor player argued. Heard one Dadfan, asked why the
runner from 3rd was out and person beside them said because she went into
the dugout giving up.

[youngump]

Originally Posted by whiskers_ump

If it was, no one, fan, coach nor player argued. Heard one Dadfan, asked why the
runner from 3rd was out and person beside them said because she went into
the dugout giving up.

So the comment is strange, but I'm not sure why you'd expect anyone to complain.
You had, ball hit to CF. Runners leave early. Ball is thrown to third. Third throws to second. Everyone leaves the field.
Why would you think anyone is paying attention to the umpire on this play?

--Ben.
________
Nice2Naughty cam