3 Man Tag Ups -ASA

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by rwest

How would you change it?

I would put U3 ump in the C for a runner on 1B only. No contention with players, fielder or runner, for running lanes; If U1 goes out, U3 has the entire game in front of him; can easily see ball, tag and be in position for a call at 2B; can still cover same areas if needed to go out; IMO, is in better position to see a tag on a steal; keeps the field more balanced and keeps U3 from running back and forth across the field every time a baserunning situation changes.

Nothing really changes except the ease of the umpire to attain a good position for the plays at hand. You actually have to work it to appreciate it.

[DeputyUICHousto]

Originally Posted by Chess Ref

Gonna be doing alot of 3 umpire games this weekend. So it's a good chance for me to get a little better at this. I'm going over page 228 and some of the info has me a little puzzled. I'm hoping for some clarification here.

R1 at 1B. we have a fly ball that neither ump goes out on. The book says the tag up responsibility is the 1B ump.

So what happens to the 3B ump who started the play in the B slot. Does he just hang around 2B and watch the play ?

It seems to me that you're gonna have 2 umps standing at 2B on this. I'm assuming I'm missing something here.

Feedback please....

Where the ball was hit?

If I remember right (and I'm going from memory), if the ball is hit down the line at 3rd base on a fly would'nt that be the plate umpire's responsibility?

Again, from memory...the plate umpire will always have the "uncovered" base on fly ball responsibility. The umpire at 2nd will have coverage from left field to right field and the umpire at the "covered" base would have from the fielder to the line and beyond.

Of course all of this depends on your UIC. I've been to National Championship Tournaments where our UIC said "Just split it down the middle".

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by rwest

Depending on what happens on the play he could be responsible for 1st. If U1rotates home, he is responsible for both 1st and 2nd. But I agree with your main point on where the U3 should be positioned.

If that happens (U1 rotates home), it would not be an "initial infield play", the phrase I used to attempt to qualify my statement.

[rwest]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

If that happens (U1 rotates home), it would not be an "initial infield play", the phrase I used to attempt to qualify my statement.

Initially U3 only has 2nd, but on a subsequent play his responsibilities may change based on U1 rotating home.

Got it!

Thanks!

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

I would put U3 ump in the C for a runner on 1B only. No contention with players, fielder or runner, for running lanes; If U1 goes out, U3 has the entire game in front of him; can easily see ball, tag and be in position for a call at 2B; can still cover same areas if needed to go out; IMO, is in better position to see a tag on a steal; keeps the field more balanced and keeps U3 from running back and forth across the field every time a baserunning situation changes.

Nothing really changes except the ease of the umpire to attain a good position for the plays at hand. You actually have to work it to appreciate it.

Worked a game like this recently, was easy and all was covered. Also non-rotated, i.e., PU stayed home, BUs covered all bases. Plus, really helped with minimizing running on a very hot day.

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by SRW

I believe with a runner on 1B only, U3 begins at a point of 3B-2B extended about 12 feet - not off F4's right shoulder.

Where did you get this positioning? I've checked all of my 3man power points and training material and I dont see 3b-2b extended. I was always taught to extend towards right center. 12ft 3-2b extended puts you farther back/deeper than I go.

[SRW]

Originally Posted by wadeintothem

Where did you get this positioning? I've checked all of my 3man power points and training material and I dont see 3b-2b extended. I was always taught to extend towards right center. 12ft 3-2b extended puts you farther back/deeper than I go.

Specifically:
- the NUS staff at the 2007 ASA Fast Pitch Camp in Georgia
- 2007 ASA Umpire Manual Pg. 255
- 2008 ASA Umpire Manual Pg. 221
- 2006 & 2007 NCAA Umpire Manuals Pg. 91

And I'm sure it's in my CCA manual, which at the moment is at home.

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by SRW

Specifically:
- the NUS staff at the 2007 ASA Fast Pitch Camp in Georgia
- 2007 ASA Umpire Manual Pg. 255
- 2008 ASA Umpire Manual Pg. 221
- 2006 & 2007 NCAA Umpire Manuals Pg. 91

And I'm sure it's in my CCA manual, which at the moment is at home.

One variation in the CCA (NCAA) version. There, you set 6-9 feet, as they have determined the predominant play is the steal tag, not the (in my mind) obvious force on the lead runner. It has been stated (and I quote EA, EC and MM at the NCAA D1 Leadoff Classic) that not only is this the predominant play according their statistics, but that it is easier (or as easy, don't want to misquote) to step back to the force calling distance (because you must always adjust to the proper angle for the throw, anyway) than it is to step forward to the tag calling distance.

Sorry to hijack; this is one of my soapbox issues. Don't accept either the alleged statistic (asked for, but was treated as leper thereafter) nor the premise that moving in reverse on a play you are required to wait and read (ball is hit, see infielder field and make throw) is even remotely better than stepping forward into a play (steal or wild pitch) that you see coming all the way (on the pitch).

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by SRW

Specifically:
- the NUS staff at the 2007 ASA Fast Pitch Camp in Georgia

Well I'll have to take your word for it since I wasnt there.

- 2007 ASA Umpire Manual Pg. 255
- 2008 ASA Umpire Manual Pg. 221

No, actually, it doesnt say that or show 3b - 2b extended in the graphic. Nor does it show it in the NUS power point on 3 man.

Emily's hand out about 3 man mechanics shows towards right center, not towards 3b-2b extended, nor does it say that.

Dunno about the NCAA manual.

[azbigdawg]

Originally Posted by wadeintothem

Well I'll have to take your word for it since I wasnt there.



No, actually, it doesnt say that or show 3b - 2b extended in the graphic. Nor does it show it in the NUS power point on 3 man.

Emily's hand out about 3 man mechanics shows towards right center, not towards 3b-2b extended, nor does it say that.

Dunno about the NCAA manual.

Basically you are one step inside the bag at 2b...right at the leading edge....perfect position for a tag play..very little movement for any other play.. .You are NOT in the standard "B" position since you have an umpire behind you.