ASA Rules - No slide at the plate.. is ball dead ?

[Andy]

Originally Posted by WeekendRef

Ok my bad . I thought it was a uniform rule that you can't run over the catcher (Again, it was not malicious the guy just evidently did not want to slide) . I guess that was my first error...
The umpire was a certified ASA guy and I thought he was handling the game using ASA rules but we do have a no contact rule which I am copying below....as I thought it makes no mention of dead ball or not (written by Parks and Rec dept not softball guys)
"Player must slide or submit to a tag if a play is being made on them . They must make every effort to avoid contact "
It also states that "Barrelling into a fielder can be considered interference or dangerous play which can result in being called out".
To me it is still somewhat nebulous...as what is "a dangerous play" ? Not sure if the runner was called out for interferece or the "dangerous play"

Because your local rule reads similar to the existing ASA rule on interference, my inference would be that the ball would be dead if the out was called based on this local rule. Runners would be sent to the last base touched at the time of the interference.

As for what is a "dangerous play", that would be left to the judgement of the individual umpire.

[Hoosier_Dave]

Sounds like interference. If the catcher was camped in front of the plate, that's obstruction. When the runner comes barreling in, that's interference which overrules obstruction. Runner out, all others return. (I've called this before). If runner would have pulled up to avoid hitting the catcher, then you have catcher obstruction and runner is awarded home. Rules reference is Point of Emphasis #14 and #36. So if the runner is a nice guy and pulls up so as not to hit the catcher, he scores on an awarded home plate and all his teammates get to stay at their bases.

[WeekendRef]

Originally Posted by Hoosier_Dave

Sounds like interference. If the catcher was camped in front of the plate, that's obstruction. When the runner comes barreling in, that's interference which overrules obstruction. Runner out, all others return. (I've called this before). If runner would have pulled up to avoid hitting the catcher, then you have catcher obstruction and runner is awarded home. Rules reference is Point of Emphasis #14 and #36. So if the runner is a nice guy and pulls up so as not to hit the catcher, he scores on an awarded home plate and all his teammates get to stay at their bases.

So in essence what you are saying that nice guys do get rewarded....I like the sound of that !

[JefferMC]

Would you contrast this to an NFHS situation that occured in the County Playoff championship game in April:

Top Second Inning (I think): Runner from third crashes into pitcher (with ball) covering the plate on a passed ball. Pitcher is injured, offensive team (A) receives a must-slide-or-be-out warning from PU, but runner scores since ball was dropped.

Bottom Third Inning (again, I think): Team B runner from third dances around catcher standing over plate waiting for ball to be relayed from outfield and touches plate before ball arrives. PU now warns team B of must-slide-rule. I'm scratching my head here because there was no play, the ball MAY have been as close as over the pitchers circle when the runner touched home.

Bottom Sixth Inning: Team B runner from third (actually same runner from bottom 3rd, who doesn't apparently doesn't know how to slide effectively [coaching error for sure]) again steps on plate behind catcher, who is actually recieving the ball (but not blocking plate) as runner reaches home. No collision. Umpire rules runner out for not sliding.

What's your opinion?

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by JefferMC

What's your opinion?

The PU needs to learn the rules.

[AtlUmpSteve]

My opinion is that PU didn't get any of these plays right. First play should have been an out on the collision (8-6-13); the second two instances were clear "no-call" plays.

[Mountaineer]

*Thread Hijack*
The first one for me is a HTBT - but sounds at least close to malicious contact. If the player has the ball in their possession - that's good enough for me. The other two? Are you kidding me? Umpires that even think there's a "must slide" rule need to have an examination - sheeeeesh. It's bad enough that parents think that's a rule.

*Hijack off*

As far as the initial thread goes - depending on the severity of the contact, someone's night may have just been shortened. According to the local rule, the "Player must slide or submit to a tag if a play is being made on them . They must make every effort to avoid contact." I assume then that they are taking the obstruction rule out of play. If a play is being made on them, they must "submit" to a tag? What the hell is that? Maybe my "special filter" got switched on again, but that just seems strange to me.