D3K & Leading off

[reccer]

Coach here, My experience is that 90% of coaches think the runner is out if she stops between the bases with the ball in the circle. Experienced Blues know the rule but are calling the out if the runner goes more than say 10 feet past the base and then stops and then restarts

If you are trying to advance your batter runner to second with runner on third and ball 4 to the batter, there will be no margin for error allowed by the Blue if your runners don't carry out the play perfectly. If the batter-runner heads for 2 and then stops and then restarts, she will be rung up. One Mississippi Two Mississippi becomes abreviated to Bam! (they don't like the squirrelly (sp?) nature of the ball 4 play).

On batted balls, Blues are generally more patient with allowing the runner to round the bags and then locate the ball.

I understand the rule, but I also understand the spirit of the rule, and I agree with the way the local Blues are enforcing the LBR.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by reccer

Coach here, My experience is that 90% of coaches think the runner is out if she stops between the bases with the ball in the circle. Experienced Blues know the rule but are calling the out if the runner goes more than say 10 feet past the base and then stops and then restarts

If you are trying to advance your batter runner to second with runner on third and ball 4 to the batter, there will be no margin for error allowed by the Blue if your runners don't carry out the play perfectly. If the batter-runner heads for 2 and then stops and then restarts, she will be rung up. One Mississippi Two Mississippi becomes abreviated to Bam! (they don't like the squirrelly (sp?) nature of the ball 4 play).

On batted balls, Blues are generally more patient with allowing the runner to round the bags and then locate the ball.

I understand the rule, but I also understand the spirit of the rule, and I agree with the way the local Blues are enforcing the LBR.

How about
- a rule is a rule is a rule
- a BR is a BR is a BR
without the inconsistency? Worse yet, personal dislikes.

[mcrowder]

Originally Posted by reccer

Experienced Blues know the rule but are calling the out if the runner goes more than say 10 feet past the base and then stops and then restarts.

Then they don't know the rule. This is wrong.

If you are trying to advance your batter runner to second with runner on third and ball 4 to the batter, there will be no margin for error allowed by the Blue if your runners don't carry out the play perfectly. If the batter-runner heads for 2 and then stops and then restarts, she will be rung up. One Mississippi Two Mississippi becomes abreviated to Bam! (they don't like the squirrelly (sp?) nature of the ball 4 play).

Again - she CAN stop and restart. If your umpires are doing as you describe, they need to be educated. Calling them experienced seems to be a stretch. In fact, she can go 1 step short of 2nd, stop, and return all the way to first. Totally legal.

On batted balls, Blues are generally more patient with allowing the runner to round the bags and then locate the ball.

I find that my patience has nothing to do with it.

I understand the rule, but I also understand the spirit of the rule, and I agree with the way the local Blues are enforcing the LBR.

Even though they are enforcing it incorrectly? Horrid.

[CecilOne]

The spirit/intent of the rule is to keep runners from pretending to run, delaying the game, taking baseball style leads, etc.; not to prevent legitimate baserunning and certainly not as a "gotcha" out. As I say on every post "Officiating takes more than OJT".

[reccer]

When she is virtually crawling ever so slowly (but within the rules), clapping her hands, verbally taunting the pitcher........ that is an abuse of the LBR

I run this play every chance I have because I have a fast team and we work on this play offensive/defensive repeatedly during practice. We don't walk and taunt because I want my batter-runner to get to second as quickly as possible (under control) so that my runner at 3 doesn't have to go all the way back to the bag.

Even at 14U, we have a high success rate of getting the runner home when the Blues leave us alone. However, as I stated earlier, their triggers are a whole lot quicker than if it were a batted ball.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by reccer

When she is virtually crawling ever so slowly (but within the rules), clapping her hands, verbally taunting the pitcher........ that is an abuse of the LBR

I run this play every chance I have because I have a fast team and we work on this play offensive/defensive repeatedly during practice. We don't walk and taunt because I want my batter-runner to get to second as quickly as possible (under control) so that my runner at 3 doesn't have to go all the way back to the bag.

Even at 14U, we have a high success rate of getting the runner home when the Blues leave us alone. However, as I stated earlier, their triggers are a whole lot quicker than if it were a batted ball.

The rule only deals with moving/stopping, no regard for speed, crawling or not. It might be abuse of the RCR, but that's the rule. The answer is as they described, "triggers are a whole lot quicker than if it were a batted ball " is horrid.

[tcblue13]

R1 on third
1 out
BR draws BB
F2 returns ball to F1 in circle
BR rounds first and runs to 2B
LBR in effect when BR touches 1B
F1 makes no play
R1 waits 3 feet down the line to see what F1 is going to do.
If R1 does not either retreat or advance when BR touches first, she is out.

I don't know why that is such an epiphany. I just makes sense. It is like the light just came on though.

If you ring her up before BR reached 2B then you send BR back to 1B on the DB

[mcrowder]

Originally Posted by tcblue13

If you ring her up before BR reached 2B then you send BR back to 1B on the DB

You got it.

One important note I've seen screwed up. You say it right there. If the out occurs before BR reaches 2B, BR goes back to 1B. I've seen it (often) called where BR is sent to second base if she was "halfway". If she's INCHES away from 2B, she goes back.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by mcrowder

Even though they are enforcing it incorrectly? Horrid.

Completely agree. Giving less time to round and locate the ball on a walk is purely umpire prejudice. The umpire doesn't like it, so he dings the runner. I like your adjective. Horrid.