The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Softball
Register FAQ Community Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #16 (permalink)  
Old Wed Mar 15, 2006, 04:50pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Crete, Nebraska
Posts: 734
Send a message via ICQ to shipwreck
That's off line from what I am asking. I am saying if as PU you call a strike on a batter you don't go for help since you saw something that convinced you it was a strike. So in Little Jimmy's post he said the fielder made a sweeeping tag attempt and the PU called her out and then went for help which was then overturned. If they were not sure shouldn't they have called her safe and then went for help and if they were sure there was a tag then why go to your partner? I just want to get it right. Dave
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old Wed Mar 15, 2006, 07:06pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Maryland (northeast of Baltimore)
Posts: 371
Maybe you had a typo, but in my post I said that base ump, not plate ump, made the original out call. Then he went to plate for some help.
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old Wed Mar 15, 2006, 08:15pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: USA
Posts: 14,565
Quote:
Originally posted by shipwreck
That's off line from what I am asking. I am saying if as PU you call a strike on a batter you don't go for help since you saw something that convinced you it was a strike. So in Little Jimmy's post he said the fielder made a sweeeping tag attempt and the PU called her out and then went for help which was then overturned. If they were not sure shouldn't they have called her safe and then went for help and if they were sure there was a tag then why go to your partner? I just want to get it right. Dave
I understood what you said.

Are you 100% sure of every call you make when you make it? Do you call what your eyes and brain tell you what happened?

For as much as we know, the ball beat the runner and the BU lost sight of the glove with the ball in it behind the runner's body that may have blocked out the umpire. There are many plays like this during the course of the game.

You call what you see. The BU may have believed he saw a tag and then had second thoughts. Personally, I'm going to make the call and let the play finish.

I'm not saying the BU was 100% on the manner in which s/he went for help, just that the book now instructs the umpire to make a call if at all possible.

You are debating whether the umpire should have to see a tag before calling a player out. I contend that umpires routinely make calls without being 100% sure the actual tag was made. A sweep tag on the BR is a perfect example. Often the BU sees F3 sweep the glove toward the back of the BR. The PU, if trailing, gets a two-dimensional look at F3's glove passing by the BR. However, it's very likely that neither were close enough or had the perfect angle to see if the BR was actually touched. Yet, an umpire will call this player out based upon the BR's reaction, a sound which the umpire believed was contact or the umpire's eyes just reasoned contact had to be made.


__________________
The bat issue in softball is as much about liability, insurance and litigation as it is about competition, inflated egos and softball.
Reply With Quote
  #19 (permalink)  
Old Wed Mar 15, 2006, 09:41pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Crete, Nebraska
Posts: 734
Send a message via ICQ to shipwreck
As I am sure you are by far the more experienced umpire, I'll go with what you say. Dave
Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)  
Old Thu Mar 16, 2006, 11:35am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: USA
Posts: 14,565
Quote:
Originally posted by shipwreck
As I am sure you are by far the more experienced umpire, I'll go with what you say. Dave
Not what I'm saying. ASA has put it in the book.
__________________
The bat issue in softball is as much about liability, insurance and litigation as it is about competition, inflated egos and softball.
Reply With Quote
  #21 (permalink)  
Old Thu Mar 16, 2006, 12:12pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Woodstock, GA; Atlanta area
Posts: 2,822
As others have said, BU is to make their best call. Not indisputable 100% evidence, but if the preponderence of evidence is that you have an out, call the out. If you really just don't know, call safe.

No matter what you call, unless you are 100% sure, be prepared and willing to ask PU for assistance and additional information from that angle if either coach asks (appropriately). In NCAA, it is mandated that you go for help if asked; everywhere else, it is a good practice.
Reply With Quote
  #22 (permalink)  
Old Thu Mar 16, 2006, 12:18pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: USA
Posts: 14,565
Quote:
Originally posted by AtlUmpSteve
preponderence of evidence

Yeah, yeah, that's the ticket!!!

Good phrase, Steve. Wish I had said it.
__________________
The bat issue in softball is as much about liability, insurance and litigation as it is about competition, inflated egos and softball.
Reply With Quote
  #23 (permalink)  
Old Thu Mar 16, 2006, 01:43pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Crete, Nebraska
Posts: 734
Send a message via ICQ to shipwreck
I completely understand what you are saying I just don't see why if they put that in the ASA book why don't they also let the PU call a strike on a batter and then have the option of going to their partner for help. Not trying to be a pain in the rear, just inquiring where there is a difference. Dave
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:36pm.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1