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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Sat Aug 06, 2005, 05:58pm
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Talking

I need someone help. (NSA Rules Mens Rules)

I am an umpire and a player but I need help with this call ok.

R1 is on first Batter is at the plate. The batter hits the ball on the ground and the pitcher fields the ball in fair territory. R1 takes two steps off 1st base and the pitcher throws the ball to first.

R1 runs back to first base.

The first base man threw the ball back to the pitcher, the pitcher then runs over the and tags R1 who is standing on first base. The umpire called them out stating that R1 had to advance.

Now I was playing and my team was batting. I have been umpiring NSA for years, I told the umpire R1 can not be out because when the pitcher touched 1st base he took away the force so there is no reason now that R1 had to advance now.

What ever the rule is can someone tell me where this rule is in the NSA rule book.

PLEASE HELP ME!!!
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old Sat Aug 06, 2005, 10:54pm
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Just look under definitions in the rule book. Section 20 of slopitch NSA and section 24 of fastpitch.

"A force out is an out that can be made only when a baserunner loses the right to the base he/she is occupying because the batter becomes a batter runner, and before the batter-runner or a succeeding baserunner has been put out."

Once the batter runner is out, force is removed. R1 can now do whatever he pleases. If his choice is to stay at first. That's just fine by me.

Sounds like your umpire really ought to think of purchasing a rule book (or heck, he can download it FREE off of the NSA website). You could also do so and have found this just as easily.

-Josh
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old Sun Aug 07, 2005, 01:28am
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Quote:
Originally posted by U_of_I_Blue
Just look under definitions in the rule book. Section 20 of slopitch NSA and section 24 of fastpitch.

"A force out is an out that can be made only when a baserunner loses the right to the base he/she is occupying because the batter becomes a batter runner, and before the batter-runner or a succeeding baserunner has been put out."

Once the batter runner is out, force is removed. R1 can now do whatever he pleases. If his choice is to stay at first. That's just fine by me.

Sounds like your umpire really ought to think of purchasing a rule book (or heck, he can download it FREE off of the NSA website). You could also do so and have found this just as easily.

-Josh
Yes I saw that, but I need to show this idiot in laymens terms. I have teh rule book, but i was nt sure if there was a case book like i have in basketball. That give different cases.
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old Sun Aug 07, 2005, 09:19am
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Though I understand the satisfaction acheived by coming here and calling the umpire names, perhaps your efforts might be better served if you study up on how to properly protest a game at the time something like this occurs in the future.
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Old Sun Aug 07, 2005, 10:05am
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Quote:
Originally posted by whaddayouknow
Though I understand the satisfaction acheived by coming here and calling the umpire names, perhaps your efforts might be better served if you study up on how to properly protest a game at the time something like this occurs in the future.
Well first of all sir, I did protest it correctly, I have been officiating NSA for 10 years.

This is an umpire we have known for years, and that comment was not made at him due to the fact that he is an umpire, it was do to the fact that he is an idiot.

This is a guy who calls infield fly with runners on 1st and 3rd.

Calls a dead ball when an over throw goes into the outfield.

So to be honest I call them like i see them. And if i was this terrible I would have no problem with someone calling me the smae thing.

But that was no attack on you or anyone else in here ok.

And to be honest, after the fact it really was not important to protest we were up by 10 or 11. And my team wanted me to protest it, but i told them that we are up. Lets get the game over with and get off his diamond. Some umpires are approachable, this one is not. I have worked a two man crew with this guy.

He was on the bases, a guy asked him a ? very nicely and he threw him out told him he does not have the right to ask a ?.
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old Sun Aug 07, 2005, 12:25pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Love this Game
Quote:
Originally posted by whaddayouknow
Though I understand the satisfaction acheived by coming here and calling the umpire names, perhaps your efforts might be better served if you study up on how to properly protest a game at the time something like this occurs in the future.
Well first of all sir, I did protest it correctly, I have been officiating NSA for 10 years.

This is an umpire we have known for years, and that comment was not made at him due to the fact that he is an umpire, it was do to the fact that he is an idiot.

This is a guy who calls infield fly with runners on 1st and 3rd.

Calls a dead ball when an over throw goes into the outfield.

So to be honest I call them like i see them. And if i was this terrible I would have no problem with someone calling me the smae thing.

But that was no attack on you or anyone else in here ok.

And to be honest, after the fact it really was not important to protest we were up by 10 or 11. And my team wanted me to protest it, but i told them that we are up. Lets get the game over with and get off his diamond. Some umpires are approachable, this one is not. I have worked a two man crew with this guy.

He was on the bases, a guy asked him a ? very nicely and he threw him out told him he does not have the right to ask a ?.
So, why is this "idiot" still umpiring? Oh my, I asked a question. Am I ejected, too?

It's not your place to show this guy the rules. It's the job of the assignor, or the association rules chairperson.

Bob

[Edited by bluezebra on Aug 7th, 2005 at 01:31 PM]
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old Sun Aug 07, 2005, 06:19pm
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old Sun Aug 07, 2005, 06:42pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by bluezebra
Quote:
Originally posted by Love this Game
Quote:
Originally posted by whaddayouknow
Though I understand the satisfaction acheived by coming here and calling the umpire names, perhaps your efforts might be better served if you study up on how to properly protest a game at the time something like this occurs in the future.
Well first of all sir, I did protest it correctly, I have been officiating NSA for 10 years.

This is an umpire we have known for years, and that comment was not made at him due to the fact that he is an umpire, it was do to the fact that he is an idiot.

This is a guy who calls infield fly with runners on 1st and 3rd.

Calls a dead ball when an over throw goes into the outfield.

So to be honest I call them like i see them. And if i was this terrible I would have no problem with someone calling me the smae thing.

But that was no attack on you or anyone else in here ok.

And to be honest, after the fact it really was not important to protest we were up by 10 or 11. And my team wanted me to protest it, but i told them that we are up. Lets get the game over with and get off his diamond. Some umpires are approachable, this one is not. I have worked a two man crew with this guy.

He was on the bases, a guy asked him a ? very nicely and he threw him out told him he does not have the right to ask a ?.
So, why is this "idiot" still umpiring? Oh my, I asked a question. Am I ejected, too?

It's not your place to show this guy the rules. It's the job of the assignor, or the association rules chairperson.

Bob

[Edited by bluezebra on Aug 7th, 2005 at 01:31 PM]
Well I guess I was using it at a teaching lesson. Because it did not cost us the game but wonder if it did for someone else.

He is still umping because of the shortage of umpires for some leagues.

He used to do basketball, but people stopped giving him games because his games would get out of control.

I have seen the assignor of our officiating crew, tell him a rule, and still he calls it his way.

So go figure!!!
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old Mon Aug 08, 2005, 10:01am
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First off, a big "Hi Ya" to a fellow Ohio blue! I am an OHSAA baseball and ASA umpire located in Columbus.

As for your original question, you've already had the correct answer supplied. After the force out is removed (B/R was retired) the runner at first may return safely to first base.

Now, a question for you. What sort of training is available for NSA umpires in Ohio? Is there a certification or registration process?

I'm curious because the largest adult slow pitch softball leagues in my area plays under NSA sanction. The Columbus Recreation and Parks department runs a summer program with over 100 leagues, made up of about 800 teams and nearly 10,000 players. As you can imagine, the need for umpires in these leagues is great!

With around 8000 games to fill, many of the umpires are less-than-great. Besides the 8000-or-so games sponsored by Columbus, the surrounding suburbs offer probably another 4000 game opportunities. And that is just for summer ball. Add in the fall programs and I would imagine nearly 20,000 slow pitch games are played in this area from April through October.

I am curious about the NSA umpire certification process, since there is a nearly unlimited opportunity to work games in my area.
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 09, 2005, 03:04pm
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i sent you a emsil
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  #11 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 10, 2005, 09:21am
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...which I promptly, accidentally deleted!

Sorry about that. Send again as I am interested in this information.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 16, 2005, 11:21pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by BretMan
...which I promptly, accidentally deleted!

Sorry about that. Send again as I am interested in this information.
i sent you a new email
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