Double Bag Question

[tzme415]

This happened to me last night..Men's SP Rec League using double base..B1 hits ground ball to F3 who bobbles the ball then runs to 1B stumbling...F3 beats runner to base but steps over white portion onto orange bag..Runner comes behind F3 as he has passed bag..I call runner safe

Captain of defensive team argues, but very respectfully saying I was wrong and the rule doesn't say that the runner is safe if the fielder doesn't touch the white portion of the base. He wanted to know if the call was protestable. I of course reread the rule later and while it doesn't specifically say the runner is safe, it does say that the fielder must use the white portion unless the throw is coming from foul territory.

2 questions:

1) Did I interpret this rule correctly and make the right call?

2) Would this be a protestable call?

[Dakota]

Originally posted by tzme415
1) Did I interpret this rule correctly and make the right call?

Yes. (ASA)

Originally posted by tzme415
2) Would this be a protestable call?

Assuming everyone agrees that the ball beat the runner to the bag and that the fielder did not touch the white base and that the fielder did touch the orange base, then, yes, it is protestable. The coach would be protesting a supposed misinterpretation of the safety base rule. He'd lose, of course.

[Bluefoot]

BR is not out, since F3 did not touch white portion of double base.

Since BR passed 1B (you did not state whether BR had touched any part of 1B) before being put out, you were correct to signal safe (as is stated in the ASA rulebook).

If BR passed, but did not touch the orange portion of the double base, then F3 could tag BR with the ball for an out, if it's before BR returns to the white portion of the double base.

[tzme415]

You are right.
I wasn't clear that BR did touch 1st base on the orange part after F3 passed over the base.
In reading the rule it just says that the fielder has to use the white with certain exceptions. Is the fielder touching the orange portion similar to the fielder missing the base completely?

[Dakota]

Originally posted by tzme415
Is the fielder touching the orange portion similar to the fielder missing the base completely?

Unless the fielder is entitled by rule to use the orange base (which is limited to a play coming from 1st base foul territory), it is exactly the same as a pulled foot.

[mcrowder]

tzme - explain to your coach that essentially, unless the ball is coming from foul ground, the orange bag is simply dirt, as far as the first baseman is concerned. F3 took the throw, and was standing on dirt, not the base.

[tzme415]

Thanks that is a good way to explain it.

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally posted by Dakota

Unless the fielder is entitled by rule to use the orange base (which is limited to a play coming from 1st base foul territory), it is exactly the same as a pulled foot.

EXCEPT that the rule 8-2.M(3) also allows F3 to use the orange bag when "an errant throw pulling the defense off the base into foul territory". Too many have misinterpreted this to mean that on any bad throw, F3 can use the orange bag, reasoning that the orange bag is in foul territory, thus the rule applies.

The proper ruling is if the throw takes F3 completely into foul territory off both bases, and the orange bag is now allowed to be the return bag, rather than force F3 to cross the path of the BR. The rule does not provide a double base for F3 to initially touch, it provides a safety base on return.