Confused again

[hukonrt]

Up here in Minnesota we're just getting ready to begin league play - finally. Just reading through the ASA Official Rules and need some help on rule 4 Section 6 Para C aka 4.6.c specifically: "The pitcher is not required to pitch until the first batter faced completes their turn at bat or the side has been retired." Can someone provide an example of what this means please?

[whiskers_ump]

hukonrt,

Up here in Minnesota we're just getting ready to begin league play - finally. Just reading through the ASA Official Rules and need some help on rule 4 Section 6 Para C aka 4.6.c specifically: "The pitcher is not required to pitch until the first batter faced completes their turn at bat or the side has been retired." Can someone provide an example of what this means please?

There use to be a rule that the person designated
F1 on
the starting line-up card had to face at least the first
batters complete turn at bat. They just saw no need for the
rule anymore .

Welcome to the boards. What part of Minnesota you from?

[hukonrt]

Thanks, Fergus Falls (near Fargo ND) ...snowed today...have been watching these boards for quite some time and picked up lots of useful information as well as had many a good laugh. Have umpired off and on since mid 70's Adult Slow Pitch, Little League now back to Adult Slow Pitch. Gets me out of the house, onto the field (best seat in the house) and into the game.

[Dakota]

Originally posted by hukonrt
"The pitcher is not required to pitch until the first batter faced completes their turn at bat or the side has been retired."

Glen has explained it, but this is my favorite all-time sentence in the ASA Rule Book.

Obviously, it does not mean what it actually says - that the pitcher can wait to pitch until after the side has been retired before throwing her first pitch!

What they meant to say was, "The pitcher may be replaced before the first batter faced completes their turn at bat or the side has been retired."

Welcome from a fellow Minnesotan - although MN is my adopted state, having lived previously in Michigan, South Carolina, Iowa, and Texas. I'm not quite so far up in the tundra as you - I'm the the Twin Cities metro area.

[hukonrt]

Since it makes so much more sense the way you wrote it, why in the world.....nah, I won't go there. I do remember the old rule, even from baseball where a pitcher must face the first batter and complete that turn at bat before being substituted for etc. Thanks for making sense out of that oh so cryptic sentence. Thought I would go nuts trying to make some sense out of it. Does anyone proofread the book before it goes to press? Incidentally, MN is where I live...originally from OK where my umpiring life began then on to CA and Little League Baseball, back to OK and more Little League, moved to MN in '00 and just got back onto the field last year. You just gotta love the Land of 10,000 Lakes and 10 bazillion mosquitoes. Adds a whole new dimension to umpiring.

[TexBlue]

Originally posted by hukonrt
Does anyone proofread the book before it goes to press?

No, Mike, he didn't mean it!!!! He's new, give him a break!!!

Welcome to the board!!!!

[Edited by TexBlue on May 1st, 2004 at 07:32 PM]

[TexBlue]

You just gotta love the Land of 10,000 Lakes and 10 bazillion mosquitoes.

Ya may have more of 'em, but ours are bigger. We can't let the little kids play ball after dark anymore. The full grown skeeters are apt to carry them off. Minimum playing weight after dark is 95 lbs. It'll be like that 'til about November.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by TexBlue

The sole purpose of this rule is to negate another great softball myth that transcended with the "little ball" people.

While Glen explained it, his sentence really doesn't belong in the rule book, either.

ASA treats every player the same when it considers substitution and reentries.

What hukonrt failed to do was quote the entire rule with which he is concerned. The first sentence of 4.6.C reads Any player may be removed from the game during any dead ball.

That should be it. No other wording is necessary. HOWEVER, as we all experience on this and many other boards, people like to insert their own beliefs based on some source outside the game of ASA softball.

This is much like the headlamp requirements in DE. A law has been on the books for years requiring the burning of headlamps of the automobile when driving during inclimate weather. The law makers, proving they are just as dumb as many of their constituents made a big deal a few years ago about passing a law which requires the burning of automobile head lamps during rain, snow or any time the windshield wipers were engaged.

Same damn law, just dummied down for those who don't know what the word "inclimate" means. Yes, yes, I know there is no entry in Merriam-Webster for such a word, but it is standardly used. And if a Hi-Skewl gratiate can figure it out as an adolescent, the state lawmakers would know better.

[DownTownTonyBrown]

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA
[... just dummied down for those who don't know what the word "inclimate" means. Yes, yes, I know there is no entry in Merriam-Webster for such a word, but it is standardly used. And if a Hi-Skewl gratiate can figure it out as an adolescent, the state lawmakers would know better.

Hmmm he says, "inclimate" is very similar to the word inclement and Merriam has a definition for inclement - stormy.

[whiskers_ump]

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA

The sole purpose of this rule is to negate another great softball myth that transcended with the "little ball" people.

While Glen explained it, his sentence really doesn't belong in the rule book, either.
_____________________________________
My sentence probably was not in the book, I can't find
my book, so just threw something out. Just knew the
rule had changed. Someone have an extra Rule Book?
_____________________________________

ASA treats every player the same when it considers substitution and reentries.

What hukonrt failed to do was quote the entire rule with which he is concerned. The first sentence of 4.6.C reads Any player may be removed from the game during any dead ball.

That should be it. No other wording is necessary. HOWEVER, as we all experience on this and many other boards, people like to insert their own beliefs based on some source outside the game of ASA softball.

This is much like the headlamp requirements in DE. A law has been on the books for years requiring the burning of headlamps of the automobile when driving during inclimate weather. The law makers, proving they are just as dumb as many of their constituents made a big deal a few years ago about passing a law which requires the burning of automobile head lamps during rain, snow or any time the windshield wipers were engaged.

Same damn law, just dummied down for those who don't know what the word "inclimate" means. Yes, yes, I know there is no entry in Merriam-Webster for such a word, but it is standardly used. And if a Hi-Skewl gratiate can figure it out as an adolescent, the state lawmakers would know better.


[/B]

[Edited by whiskers_ump on May 2nd, 2004 at 03:18 PM]

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by DownTownTonyBrown

Hmmm he says, "inclimate" is very similar to the word inclement and Merriam has a definition for inclement - stormy.

Thank you, but you would be surprised by those who use "inclimate", including many educational institutions.

[hukonrt]

What hukonrt failed to do was quote the entire rule with which he is concerned. The first sentence of 4.6.C reads Any player may be removed from the game during any dead ball.

That should be it. No other wording is necessary. HOWEVER, as we all experience on this and many other boards, people like to insert their own beliefs based on some source outside the game of ASA softball.

__________________________________________________ ______

I really had no difficulty with the first sentence and do not intend to belabor the point...BUT...that second sentence, although crystal clear in my mind at this time, does tend to add unnecessary ambiguity to the rule.

Thanks to all for the assistance. This is rapidly becoming one of my favorite websites.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by hukonrt
What hukonrt failed to do was quote the entire rule with which he is concerned. The first sentence of 4.6.C reads Any player may be removed from the game during any dead ball.

That should be it. No other wording is necessary. HOWEVER, as we all experience on this and many other boards, people like to insert their own beliefs based on some source outside the game of ASA softball.

__________________________________________________ ______

I really had no difficulty with the first sentence and do not intend to belabor the point...BUT...that second sentence, although crystal clear in my mind at this time, does tend to add unnecessary ambiguity to the rule.

I wasn't referring to you as own of those with their own beliefs. However, even on here, we ocassionally run across someone who still believes certain baseball rules apply to all games involving a bat and ball.

That is until they are converted

[whiskers_ump]

Mike has certainly tried to convert everyone. However, I
do agree. Baseball rules are for baseball. Questions on
BB rules belong on the BB board. Answers to softball
questions should not be given utilizing OBR rules. They
differ in too many cases.