IP w/o Pitch

[RKBUmp]

Our state rules interpreter says it is a delayed dead ball and it only becomes dead immediately when the pitcher chooses not to deliver the pitch.

This is something someone with ties to the national office needs to kick up for an interpretation because the rule book does seem to conflict.

[CecilOne]

The point of an IP is to not disadvantage the batter; that is why IP are DDB; allowing the batter to hit (or ...) the pitch. So, why kill a pitch prematurely?


caveat: I don't care about NCAA

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

The point of an IP is to not disadvantage the batter; that is why IP are DDB; allowing the batter to hit (or ...) the pitch. So, why kill a pitch prematurely?

NFHS Rule 5-1-1p says the ball becomes dead immediately when "an illegal pitch occurs, but no pitch is delivered to the batter." That would imply to me that certain IP violations are killed as soon as they happen. But I guess I'm wrong there.

And I realize that you don't care about the NCAA, but there is an approved ruling that has as its scenario a pitcher who licks her fingers after delivering Ball Four to the batter, and before the BR arrives at first base, she grabs the ball without wiping off. The ruling states that the umpire calls IP and makes the award of moving the BR to second, and adding a ball to the count on the next batter. There is no DDB to allow the next batter to get in the box and try to hit the pitch.

[DaveASA/FED]

Originally Posted by Manny A

NFHS Rule 5-1-1p says the ball becomes dead immediately when "an illegal pitch occurs, but no pitch is delivered to the batter." That would imply to me that certain IP violations are killed as soon as they happen. But I guess I'm wrong there.

What that is saying is, as with any illegal pitch you call it illegal when it becomes illegal. Calling the illegal pitch is signalling a delayed dead ball and saying illegal. IF the pitcher stops and backs off the pitching plate and does not throw a pitch, we do not have a stalemate and stand there with our left arm extended.....we then call a dead ball and enforce the illegal pitch penalty.

So one situation with two outcomes.

A pitcher steps onto the pitching plate with her hands together. This is an illegal pitch and the plate umpire signals delayed dead ball and verbalizes "illegal pitch" when the pitcher steps onto the pitching plate with their hands together. In a) the pitcher continues her preliminaries and delivers a pitch. In b) the pitcher stops her progression, steps back off the pitching plate and seperates her hands looking at the plate umpire.

In a) we allow the pitch to be delivered and the batter has the right to hit the ball, knowing it is an illegal pitch.

In b) it is obvious that the pitcher is not going to deliver a pitch so we would then call a dead ball and enforce the illegal pitch penalty.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Manny A

And I realize that you don't care about the NCAA, but there is an approved ruling that has as its scenario a pitcher who licks her fingers after delivering Ball Four to the batter, and before the BR arrives at first base, she grabs the ball without wiping off. The ruling states that the umpire calls IP and makes the award of moving the BR to second, and adding a ball to the count on the next batter. There is no DDB to allow the next batter to get in the box and try to hit the pitch.

An illegal pitch when there is not a pitch opportunity.

[Little Jimmy]

Throw out the already bantered Utrip exception for this discussion...

Speaking Fed, I've always been under the assumption that it's immediate deadball for things like licking fingers with no wipe, grinding the ball into the dirt, taking a nail file out and using it on the ball, etc. When that act takes place, the pitch doesn't take place.

Then there's the other category, the everything is OK until but there's the double touch, leap, stepping outside of the 24", etc. where the rules state that we have delayed dead ball giving the batter an opportunity to hit the ball.

I think Fed is pretty clear about what's what and when it's applied.

[Tru_in_Blu]

I think Dave has it right.

I'm trying to recall an IP that I called for a double touch that ended up with a pitch being delivered. I can't remember one.

When the IP is called, pitchers almost always stop their delivery. At that point, the call of a dead ball is appropriate.

IPs called with a pitch being made would more likely be a result of foot fouls. Those almost always result in a pitch being thrown. Sometimes, if called by the BU and the PU didn't hear the call, things can get a bit confusing. But just take the time and sort things out.